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RE: Minutes from User Agent Teleconference for March 20 2008 (new time 2pm Eastern)

From: Kelly Ford <kford@windows.microsoft.com>
Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2008 05:55:53 -0700
To: WAI-UA list <w3c-wai-ua@w3.org>
Message-ID: <D704CCE9AA2AC346951C3AB7D2A5CA0E404714E6CB@NA-EXMSG-W602.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com>


I have confirmed with Sean Hayes that attendance at next week's meeting will work.


-----Original Message-----
From: w3c-wai-ua-request@w3.org [mailto:w3c-wai-ua-request@w3.org] On Behalf Of Jan Richards
Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2008 12:30 PM
To: WAI-UA list
Subject: Minutes from User Agent Teleconference for March 20 2008 (new time 2pm Eastern)


Action Items:
ACTION: JR to Try out charter generator with wording to cover UAWG
communication with other format groups
ACTION: JR to In new charter clarify v2.0
ACTION: JR to Under "Scope" "Increase membership" should not be in
there...should be in Participation e.g. 10 active members

Full text:

JA: Has been talking to someone else about joining as an Invited Expert

JB: Met some people at CSUN
... Checking UA site...
... Jim, please send me email at end of meeting.
... ANother person...
... At discussion of media and captions...
... Person is an accessibility consultant
... Will send him mail to follow up

JA: I have some other cards as well

JB: We do need to be careful that when people step into meetings they
sign the patent policy
... OK so it looks like we could be adding several new people

1. First Public Working Draft & Charter
JB: Technically the draft is out as a dreft of a document on Note track
... Because our charter doesn't currently allow a new Rec track doc.
... JB: Wasn't caught as early as it could have been

<AllanJ> http://www.w3.org/WAI/UA/2007/draft_uawg_charter_21feb07.html

Existing charter: http://www.w3.org/WAI/UA/charter-20041107.html

Draft NEW charter:

JA: Milestones need to be changed but aren't too far off
... Based on CG call should we put formal dependencies on Compound Docs
and WebAPI

JB: "Formal Dependency" means...
... Usually between PF and other W3 groups...
... What's needed here is that UA group will be reviewing what those
other groups are doing
... Think charter generator has different wording
... Under this call most relationships would be through PF, and actually
would want more direct ability to go directly to other W3 groups
... Former chair was frustrated by that
... Think its a good way to get progress in general on user agent
accessibility support across WAI

KF: Agree that it's better if UAWG can contribute out rather than
waiting for things to come in.

JA: Maybe just say "The UAWG may also interact with the following
non-WAI W3C Working Groups."

JB: Maybe still makes sense to channel some stuff through PF
... So if promoting a particular strategy that should go through PF
... So maybe "except where we're coordinating on compound docs, Web
APIs, or user agent support"

JA: "user agent support" too broad?

JB: I mean like guidance...SVG spec...so SVG players...so UAWG would
help with developer guidance on player features

JR: Sounds ok, but no hard division possible

<scribe> ACTION: JR to Try out charter generator with wording to cover
UAWG communication with other format groups [recorded in

JB: All charters will get cross-reviewed in CG

KF: Other things that need to be changed are all the timelines

JB: Should be chartered through Rec and then follow on work....test
suites etc.
... May make sense to charter for 2 or 3 year period
... Also under deliverables, specify v2.0

<scribe> ACTION: JR to In new charter clarify v2.0 [recorded in

JB: Charter should start July 1?

JA: Shouldn't charter pre-date draft?

JB: Can't predate what happened last week.
... But maybe we could say April 1
... Not just "Publish", "Publish Recommendation"
... "Develop test suites for user agents that render HTML and CSS. "
seems too narrow

JA: What to add?

KF: Would we do the test suites?
... Shouldn't CSS suite go to CSS group?
... We should advise and contribute as appropriate

JB: Catch under W3C Process....Last Call...then CR...then final Rec
... Under CR need several interoperable implementations...test suites
help prove this.
... So we need to do test suites
... It's another reason we need more people on the group

JA: So what happens if we;re doing HTML4 and then HTML5 comes out

<AllanJ> JR: UA level of abstraction is higher

<AllanJ> ... test cases are difficult

JB: In WAI we customize
... Requirements document could also be an exit criteria

<AllanJ> JR: AU and UA have even larger problem

JB: Doesn't work that way in WAI

JA: John S. and I discussing this several years ago...
... WCAG tells them what to do...but needed to bring it into a user
agent to do the test

JB: Sounds good

JA: Yeah but we didn't do it

JB: So maybe this is enough on the charter today
... Under "Scope" "Increase membership" should not be in there...should
be in Participation

<scribe> ACTION: JR to Under "Scope" "Increase membership" should not be
in there...should be in Participation e.g. 10 active members [recorded
in http://www.w3.org/2008/03/20-ua-minutes.html#action03]

2. ARIA User Agent Implementors Guide
JA: Some discussion of whether UAAG wiki could be used....prob not
... But we should review it
... It's a huge document


KF: And more coming

JA: I heard that Safari is starting to incorporate HTML5 tags

JB: Really?

JA: Nothing prevents them

Maybe here: http://developer.mozilla.org/en/docs/ARIA_UA_Best_Practices


JA: Based on conversation with AG, the browser group will go off and
talk about it.

JB: ANd if they want to come back to UAWG space should we welcome them?
... Yes

JA: Yes

KF: Yes

JA: Would they all have to sign up?

JB: Yes

JA: If we start doing this more with Pierre and Geoff is there a quick
process page for this?

JB: Most on participation page already

JR: Phillipe

JB: So keyboard Agneda item to next week

JA: Anything on TEITAC wiki that we should point to?

JB: Yes and more coming - I'll send it along

JA: Can't make it on April 3rd

JB: Can't make it on April 17,24
... I'll be co-chairing the UAWG for a few months

JA: Certainly helpful

Jim Allan wrote:
> User Agent Teleconference for March 20 2008 (new time 2pm Eastern)
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> Chair: Jim Allan
> Date: Thursday, March 20 2008
> Time: 2:00-3:00 pm Boston Local Time, USA (19:00-20:00 UTC/GMT)
> Call-in: Zakim bridge at: +1-617-761-6200, code 82941# for UK use
> 44-117-270-6152
> IRC: sever: irc.w3.org, port: 6665, channel: #ua.
> -------------------------------------------------------------
> Regrets:
> Agenda:
> 0. Regrets, agenda requests, or comments to the list
> 1. First Public Working Draft & Charter
> 2. ARIA User Agent Implementors Guide
>       http://developer.mozilla.org/en/docs/ARIA_UA_Best_Practices
>       Currently under development - review?
> 3. Review Keyboard Access
>       http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2008JanMar/0052.html
>       http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2008JanMar/0053.html
> Jim Allan, Webmaster & Statewide Technical Support Specialist
> Texas School for the Blind and Visually Impaired
> 1100 W. 45th St., Austin, Texas 78756
> voice 512.206.9315    fax: 512.206.9264  http://www.tsbvi.edu/
>>>> Share to Win! <<<

Jan Richards, M.Sc.
User Interface Design Specialist
Adaptive Technology Resource Centre (ATRC)
Faculty of Information Studies
University of Toronto

   Email: jan.richards@utoronto.ca
   Web:   http://jan.atrc.utoronto.ca
   Phone: 416-946-7060
   Fax:   416-971-2896
Received on Friday, 21 March 2008 12:58:33 UTC

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