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Re: LIFT Text Transcoder

From: Jon Gunderson <jongund@uiuc.edu>
Date: Mon, 27 Feb 2006 08:51:46 -0600
To: Access Systems <accessys@smart.net>
Cc: Adaptive Technology International <ati3@sympatico.ca>, Léonie Watson <lw@nomensa.com>, WAI Interest Group <w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>
Message-Id: <d0782ff3.9132cd6b.8233700@expms1.cites.uiuc.edu>
Right there are accessibility requirements under section 504 
and there are legal cases in the courts related to extending 
ADA to include web technology accessibility.  It is just not 
specifically stated in the law that Section 508 Information 
Technology Accessibility Standards is the requirement. 

Hopefully Section 508 would be updated to include more 
functional accessibility requirements of WCAG and that these 
enhancedrequirements would be legally defined for Section 
504 and ADA.

Jon


---- Original message ----
>Date: Mon, 27 Feb 2006 09:23:37 -0500 (EST)
>From: Access Systems <accessys@smart.net>  
>Subject: Re: LIFT Text Transcoder  
>To: Jon Gunderson <jongund@uiuc.edu>
>Cc: Adaptive Technology International <ati3@sympatico.ca>, 
 Léonie Watson <lw@nomensa.com>, WAI Interest Group <w3c-wai-
ig@w3.org>
>
>
>On Mon, 27 Feb 2006, Jon Gunderson wrote:
>
>> No.  Section 508 has limited legal interpretations to
>> websites actually hosted by the united states federal
>> government.  Although in other contexts in might serve as 
a
>> defacto minimum standard for other types of litigation in
>> the U.S.
>
>but section 504 has authority over any federal reciepient, 
and to
>determine what is appropriate compliance it turns to the 
ATBCB for
>guidance and they reference back to section 508 and W3C/WAI 
level 3  none
>of which these software products comply with,  I checked em 
and they
>flunked pretty badly.
>
>Bob
>
>
>>
>> Jon
>>
>>
>> ---- Original message ----
>> >Date: Fri, 24 Feb 2006 18:03:19 -0500
>> >From: "Adaptive Technology International"
>> <ati3@sympatico.ca>
>> >Subject: Re: LIFT Text Transcoder
>> >To: "Jon Gunderson" <jongund@uiuc.edu>, Léonie Watson
>> <lw@nomensa.com>, "WAI Interest Group" <w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>
>> >
>> >Does Section 508 can serve for international standard for
>> the web
>> >accessibility         issues?
>> >
>> >----- Original Message -----
>> >From: "Jon Gunderson" <jongund@uiuc.edu>
>> >To: "Léonie Watson" <lw@nomensa.com>; "WAI Interest 
Group"
>> ><w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>
>> >Sent: Friday, February 24, 2006 10:12 AM
>> >Subject: RE: LIFT Text Transcoder
>> >
>> >
>> >> It should also be pointed out that in both Section 508 
and
>> >> WCAG 1.0 a text only site is not considered an 
accessible
>> >> solution.  Basically the requirements state that the
>> author
>> >> has determined that the primary site CANNOT be made
>> >> accessible, and the text only site provides some kind 
of
>> >> second class access to the content.
>> >>
>> >> I think there is some kind of assumption that "Text 
Only"
>> is
>> >> some how equivalent to making the primary site 
accessible.
>> >>
>> >> Jon
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> ---- Original message ----
>> >> >Date: Fri, 24 Feb 2006 11:39:27 -0000
>> >> >From: Léonie Watson <lw@nomensa.com>
>> >> >Subject: RE: LIFT Text Transcoder
>> >> >To: "WAI Interest Group" <w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >Patrick Lauke wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> >"I'll be contentious and say: if a site is built well
>> from
>> >> the start (e.g. separating content from presentation - 
no
>> >> tables for layout, for instance - and proper 
structuring
>> via
>> >> headings etc) there is no difference between using
>> a "proper"
>> >> text browser, screen reader, or other AT with content
>> that's
>> >> been passed through the transcoder. In my mind, this is
>> only
>> >> useful if the original site is not built with standards
>> etc to
>> >> begin with...a band-aid solution, at best."
>> >> >
>> >> > Eloquently put. I'd add to this technical argument by
>> saying
>> >> that for many people a text only option is a second 
class
>> >> solution.
>> >> >
>> >> > It's rare to find a text only site that offers the 
same
>> >> quality of content as a primary site. Even with tools
>> such as
>> >> Betsie or the transcoder, as Patrick later said, there 
are
>> >> always elements that can't be touched by this kind of
>> technology.
>> >> >
>> >> > If the site is designed right in the first place,
>> there's no
>> >> need to take on the burden of an additional site, 
paying
>> the
>> >> licence for another tool to make up the shortfall of 
poor
>> >> design and no need to relegate people to a second best
>> site.
>> >> >
>> >> >Regards,
>> >> >Léonie.
>> >> >
>> >> >-----Original Message-----
>> >> >From: w3c-wai-ig-request@w3.org
>> >> [mailto:w3c-wai-ig-request@w3.org] On Behalf Of Patrick
>> H. Lauke
>> >> >Sent: Thursday, 23 February 2006 19:05
>> >> >To: WAI Interest Group
>> >> >Subject: Re: LIFT Text Transcoder
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >ATI wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> >> I have the following two questions if anyone has 
used
>> or
>> >> using the
>> >> >> LIFT Text Transcoder
>> >> http://transcoder.usablenet.com/tt/index.html

>> >> >>
>> >> >> 1. Can I use the LIFT Text Transcoder offline? I 
mean,
>> if I
>> >> provide
>> >> >> the web content or the product by CDS, can a blind
>> user use
>> >> the LIFT
>> >> >> Text Transcoder with out connecting through the
>> internet line?
>> >> >> You know, some people are using very slow internet
>> >> connection and
>> >> >> others even don't have internet connection at all.
>> >> >
>> >> > From what I can see, it's a server-side solution that
>> needs
>> >> to fetch web content, transform it, and then re-deliver
>> it via
>> >> the browser...so my guess would be no.
>> >> >
>> >> >> 2. who is the main beneficiaries of LIFT Text
>> Transcoder?
>> >> >
>> >> >I'll be contentious and say: if a site is built well
>> from the
>> >> start (e.g. separating content from presentation - no
>> tables
>> >> for layout, for instance - and proper structuring via
>> headings
>> >> etc) there is no difference between using a "proper" 
text
>> >> browser, screen reader, or other AT with content that's
>> been
>> >> passed through the transcoder. In my mind, this is only
>> useful
>> >> if the original site is not built with standards etc to
>> begin
>> >> with...a band-aid solution, at best. And, if the 
original
>> site
>> >> is *badly* inaccessible, even the text transcoder 
won't be
>> >> able to magically make it accessible (e.g. if you have
>> videos
>> >> embedded in pages, not using structural markup, or 
similar
>> >> situations, LIFT won't automatically generate text
>> transcripts
>> >> or give proper structure to the pages either).
>> >> >I'd argue that it's a server-side solution to a 
problem
>> that,
>> >> if the site is designed/built properly, does not exist.
>> The
>> >> core functionality and a lot of the customisation 
options
>> that
>> >> the transcoder provides (such as changing font size or
>> colour)
>> >> are things that, in my view, should all be handled 
client-
>> side.
>> >> >
>> >> >P
>> >> >--
>> >> >Patrick H. Lauke
>> >>
>> 
>__________________________________________________________
>> >> >re·dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used
>> postpositively
>> >> [latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.]
>> >> www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk
>> >> http://redux.deviantart.com

>> >> 
__________________________________________________________
>> >> >Web Standards Project (WaSP) Accessibility Task Force
>> >> http://webstandards.org/

>> >> 
__________________________________________________________
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Jon Gunderson, Ph.D.
>> >> Director of IT Accessibility Services
>> >> Campus Information Technologies and Educational 
Services
>> (CITES)
>> >> and
>> >> Coordinator of Assistive Communication and Information
>> Technology
>> >> Disability Resources and Education Services (DRES)
>> >>
>> >> Voice: (217) 244-5870
>> >> Fax: (217) 333-0248
>> >> Cell: (217) 714-6313
>> >>
>> >> E-mail: jongund@uiuc.edu
>> >>
>> >> WWW: http://cita.rehab.uiuc.edu/

>> >> WWW: https://netfiles.uiuc.edu/jongund/www/

>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>>
>>
>> Jon Gunderson, Ph.D.
>> Director of IT Accessibility Services
>> Campus Information Technologies and Educational Services 
(CITES)
>> and
>> Coordinator of Assistive Communication and Information 
Technology
>> Disability Resources and Education Services (DRES)
>>
>> Voice: (217) 244-5870
>> Fax: (217) 333-0248
>> Cell: (217) 714-6313
>>
>> E-mail: jongund@uiuc.edu
>>
>> WWW: http://cita.rehab.uiuc.edu/

>> WWW: https://netfiles.uiuc.edu/jongund/www/

>>
>>
>>
>
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Jon Gunderson, Ph.D.
Director of IT Accessibility Services
Campus Information Technologies and Educational Services (CITES)
and 
Coordinator of Assistive Communication and Information Technology
Disability Resources and Education Services (DRES)

Voice: (217) 244-5870
Fax: (217) 333-0248
Cell: (217) 714-6313

E-mail: jongund@uiuc.edu

WWW: http://cita.rehab.uiuc.edu/

WWW: https://netfiles.uiuc.edu/jongund/www/



Received on Monday, 27 February 2006 14:52:00 GMT

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