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Re: Frames [Re: ADA Applies to Web]

From: Charles McCathieNevile <charles@w3.org>
Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 14:26:28 -0500 (EST)
To: Richard Premack <richardp@akamail.com>
cc: Patrick Burke <burke@ucla.edu>, "Gregory J. Rosmaita" <unagi69@concentric.net>, WAI Interest Group Emailing List <w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.20.0003051421390.21351-100000@tux.w3.org>
SOrry for the slow reply.

http://www.rachelmello.com

is a framed site with noframes in it.

There is a bit of stuff at
http://sunrise.eng.monash.edu.au/sunrise/html4/TUTORIAL/FRAMES.HTM (which was
an attempt to explain how to use frames properly)

http://www.alphaworks.ibm.com uses frames. The oframes area only provides a
link to a text-only diet version, but that does at least get you through to
all the pages you might be looking for.

There are others out there...

Charles McCN

On Mon, 14 Feb 2000, Richard Premack wrote:

  Hi All.
  
  I find this thread on accessibility of FRAMES very interesting as a
  user-agent developer.  We have just recently enhanced our product, a
  telephone-based browser, to support frames, but have been disappointed by
  the marginal increase in accessibility.  We have observed as Martin
  McCormick, that many FRAMES are either labeled poorly or not at all.  I
  have yet to run into a site that has anything in the NOFRAMES section other
  than a "raspberry" (sorry, but you lose) or a link to upgrade.  To me, this
  is the height of laziness in web design -- hard is it to throw your main
  index link and perhaps a few more in between two tags?
  
  We currently support a 'deep link', that may be stored for later sessions,
  but someone may not get that far if they can't even navigate the initial
  FRAMESET properly.  We would be happy to modify our browser with either a
  setting that turns off frames or perhaps even better, chooses the NOFRAMES
  option automatically if available -- if, we thought there was any NOFRAMES
  content out there.  Does anyone know of a site that actually implements
  NOFRAMES?
  
  Regards,
  
  Richard Premack
  richardp@akamail.com
  
  interNext - creators of Tel-WWW
  http://www.inter-next.net
  ----------
  From: Gregory J. Rosmaita <unagi69@concentric.net>
  To: Patrick Burke <burke@ucla.edu>
  Cc: WAI Interest Group Emailing List <w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>
  Subject: Re: Frames [Re: ADA Applies to Web]
  Date: Monday, February 14, 2000 10:16 AM
  
  aloha, patrick!
  
  you asked:
  
  quote
  As a semi-tangent, is there a way to force IE or Netscape to display a
  NOFRAMES section of a site?
  unquote
  
  no, as far as i am aware, the only GUI browser that will allow you turn off
  
  support for frames, so as to expose the content of the NOFRAMES is Opera-- 
  i'd recommend you download a copy from:
  http://www.operasoft.com/download.html
  
  and try it....
  
  you also asked:
  
  quote
  I'm asking out of theoretical curiosity. If someone designed a functional 
  NOFRAMES section conveying all the information of the frames page, would an
  
  IE/Nets user be stuck with the framey version?
  unquote
  
  unfortunately, the way things stand today, the IE or NS user would have no 
  choice but to use the FRAMESET
  
  gregory
  
  
  --------------------------------------------------------
  He that lives on Hope, dies farting
        -- Benjamin Franklin, Poor Richard's Almanack, 1763
  --------------------------------------------------------
  Gregory J. Rosmaita <unagi69@concentric.net>
      WebMaster and Minister of Propaganda, VICUG NYC
           <http://www.hicom.net/~oedipus/vicug/index.html>
  --------------------------------------------------------
  

--
Charles McCathieNevile    mailto:charles@w3.org    phone: +61 (0) 409 134 136
W3C Web Accessibility Initiative                      http://www.w3.org/WAI
Location: I-cubed, 110 Victoria Street, Carlton VIC 3053
Postal: GPO Box 2476V, Melbourne 3001,  Australia 
Received on Sunday, 5 March 2000 14:26:45 GMT

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