Re: new wording and title for contextual information

>the intent is to extend this concept to *all* controls and widgets

 I thought we put it at AAA because it would require the COGA metadata
rather than any public metadata scheme...

At AA, I still find the allowance of any metadata scheme to be confusing...
how will the currently non-existing technology know which scheme to use....
will it have a library of all popular schemes, and if a control uses any of
the them it will identify it as that purpose.

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On Wed, Dec 20, 2017 at 5:39 PM, John Foliot <john.foliot@deque.com> wrote:

> Hi Gregg,
>
> > One issue that is open that things are not programmatically determined
> unless you specify what the “term” or handle is as well as the definition right
> now you specify the definition but allow authors to use any name or handle
> they want.
>
>
> Are you confusing this one with SC 1.3.4 Identify Common Purpose (AA),
> which is Issue #635 <https://github.com/w3c/wcag21/issues/635>? I had
> responded to your comment there directly - that the "name" (or handle) is
> nothing more than a placeholder for a control associated to a concept, and
> that the use of metadata here is what provides the programmatic
> association. At AA, we are working from *a fixed list of COMMON controls
> or widgets*, and the goal is to fill in the 4th piece of important
> information that currently ARIA does not provide: Purpose (ARIA only
> provides Role, State and Property). As I suggested previously, you can call
> your widget whatever you want (in whatever language you want), but if it
> fills one of those common "purposes", then the control is in scope for that
> SC, and any public metadata libraries that are sufficient for this SC will
> include a standardized definition for the purpose of that specific control.
>
> Meanwhile, at AAA we have this SC: Contextual Information (or perhaps
> re-named), and here the intent is to extend this concept to *all* controls
> and widgets (above and beyond the fixed list in SC1.3.4). Once again, the
> ultimate solution is to use a form of metadata - and here, the draft Personalization
> Semantics 1.0 <https://www.w3.org/TR/personalization-semantics-1.0/> is
> envisioned to be the primary means of meeting this SC.
>
> I too remain personally sceptical that this will ever be fully measurable,
> as "everything" is both subjective and non-measurable, and I think there
> will be a fair bit of opinion on what is in scope or not, but given this is
> at AAA perhaps that is less concerning. (Although your Issue #636
> <https://github.com/w3c/wcag21/issues/636> suggests that you agree with
> me on the first part, but see this as a show-stopper. I'm not sure I agree
> 100%, even if I share some of that concern, only because when you start
> adding up AI and metadata, it becomes a lot more powerful than a direct
> programmatic IDREF instance, such as how we use aria-labelledby or
> aria-describedby today. So I remain hopeful that this will still pave the
> way forward, even if support today is or will-be weak.)
>
>
> The history of these two SC was that originally they were a single SC, at
> level A, that was seeking what we currently see in the SC 1.3.5. Knowing
> that an open-ended list of controls, regions, symbols, etc. was perhaps
> overly broad, we set about constraining the list to a sub-set of
> "everything" for SC 1.3.4 (at AA). One benefit here is that if we start the
> masses off with a fixed and constrained list (SC 1.3.4 @ AA), they will
> begin to understand and appreciate why this additional metadata is so
> important, and it is part of the learning curve towards meeting 1.3.5 (@
> AAA).
>
> HTH
>
> JF
>
>
>
> On Wed, Dec 20, 2017 at 2:26 PM, Gregg Vanderheiden GPII <
> gregg@raisingthefloor.org> wrote:
>
>> I don’t know what the issues are that you think are still open
>> — so don’t know what you mean by “other issues”.
>>
>> One issue that is open that things are not programmatically determined
>> unless you specify what the “term” or handle is as well as the definition
>> right now you specify the definition but allow authors to use any name or
>> handle they want.   See issue 636
>>
>> Otherwise I think this is on track
>>
>> Gregg
>>
>>
>> On Dec 20, 2017, at 11:45 AM, lisa.seeman <lisa.seeman@zoho.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Were there any more issues with the new proposed wording for contextual
>> information (see below)?
>>
>> We are discussing it tomorrow so if there are more issues it would be
>> useful to know now so we have a shot at solving it
>>
>>
>> ---- On Sun, 17 Dec 2017 10:07:53 +0200 *lisa.seeman<lisa.seeman@zoho.com
>> <lisa.seeman@zoho.com>>* wrote ----
>>
>> Hi
>>
>> I would like to suggest the following as new wording and title for
>> contextual information. I think this addresses most of the concerns. Please
>> let me know as soon as possible any remaining issues:
>>
>> Identify Purpose (new label) AAA
>> *In content implemented using markup languages, the purpose of controls,
>> symbols, and regions can be programmatically determined.*
>>
>>
>> *definitions*
>>
>> *symbol*: an image that indicates, signifies, or is understood as
>> representing an idea or object such as, icons and the images used in AAC
>> communications.
>>
>> *region*:  a perceivable section containing content that is relevant to
>> a specific, author-specified purpose and sufficiently important that users
>> may likely want to be able to navigate to the section easily and to have it
>> listed in a summary of the page or may want it hidden for simplified
>> versions. Any area that would require a landmark role would be a region.
>>
>> (taken from aria  - other then the last sentence and a half)
>>
>>
>> *Old wording*
>> In content implemented using markup languages, contextual information
>> <https://w3c.github.io/wcag21/guidelines/#dfn-contextual-information> for
>> controls, symbols, and regions can be programmatically determined using a
>> publicly available vocabulary.
>>
>> All the best
>>
>> Lisa Seeman
>>
>> LinkedIn <http://il.linkedin.com/in/lisaseeman/>, Twitter
>> <https://twitter.com/SeemanLisa>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> John Foliot
> Principal Accessibility Strategist
> Deque Systems Inc.
> john.foliot@deque.com
>
> Advancing the mission of digital accessibility and inclusion
>