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RE: F68 forbids WAI ARIA to replace label element

From: Christophe Strobbe <christophe.strobbe@esat.kuleuven.be>
Date: Fri, 01 Jul 2011 20:28:03 +0200
Message-Id: <6.2.5.6.2.20110701191853.04b5cc60@esat.kuleuven.be>
To: "WCAG" <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org>
Hi,


At 20:20 29-6-2011, David MacDonald wrote:
>Perhaps that's a good point, I'm wondering which manufacturers are not
>getting on WAI ARIA. I think our unofficial rule of thumb is about 3
>versions back...
>
>Almost every screen reader supports WAI ARIA, although some better than
>others, and the new browsers do... which are free.

"Some better than others", indeed.
Marco Zehe's "WAI-ARIA Windows screen reader 
shootout" [1] from July 2009 mentioned the 
following AT with some WAI-ARIA support:
* NVDA (snapshot build that was similar to the 0.6p3 release)
* JAWS 10.0.1154 (current version is JAWS 12)
* Window-Eyes 7.1 (current version is Window-Eyes 7.5.1)
* SuperNova 11.02 (current version is 12.03)
* System Access To Go
If "3 versions back" requires 3 major versions 
(as opposed to XX.yy), then we will have to wait a bit longer...
Marco Zehe checked support for landmarks (only 
JAWS announced them), aria-required (variable 
support), Yahoo Search (which currently uses YUI 
and aria-labelledby but I don't know if the code 
is still the same as two years ago) and Google Chat.

Some other documents on WAI-ARIA support in AT:
* Léonie Watson: "Screen Readers And WAI-ARIA 
Landmark Roles", 10 March 2010 (landmarks in 
JAWS, NVDA and Window-Eyes; AT versions not mentioned) [2]
* Steve Faulkner: "JAWS Support for ARIA", 7 
October 2010; (aria-labelledy worked; test version was probably JAWS 10) [3].
* Lucica Ibanescu: "How screen readers speak a 
page with HTML5 and ARIA", 24 January 2011 
(landmarks in JAWS, NVDA and Window-Eyes; AT 
versions not mentioned) [4].* Jason Kiss: "HTML5, 
ARIA Roles, and Screen Readers in March 2011": 
covers JAWS 12, NVDA 2011.1, Window-Eyes 7.5, 
SATogo 3.2.197, VoiceOver 3; also checks support for aria-labelledy [5].

There is also support in  VoiceOver (for Mac OS 
X) and Orca (for Linux), but I have no test 
reports. Some comparisons also test VoiceOver, 
but many other AT are not considered: SUE (also 
for Linux), the web-based screen reader Web 
Anywhere, many other Windows AT such as ZoomText 
(by Ai Squared), HAL (by Dolphin), Thunder (by 
Claro Software), COBRA (successor of Blindows, by 
Baum), let alone products that are targeted at 
certain Asian markets (China, Japan, Korea, India, ...).
So stating that "Almost every screen reader 
supports WAI ARIA" requires many more "screen reader shootouts"...


[1] Marco Zehe: "The WAI-ARIA Windows screen reader shootout":
   <http://www.marcozehe.de/2009/07/01/the-wai-aria-windows-screen-reader-shootout/>.
[2] Léonie Watson: "Screen Readers And WAI-ARIA 
Landmark Roles", 10 March 2010:
   <http://www.nomensa.com/blog/2010/screen-readers-and-aria-landmark-roles/>.
[3] Steve Faulkner: "JAWS Support for ARIA", 7 October 2010:
   <http://www.paciellogroup.com/blog/2010/10/jaws-support-for-aria/>.
[4] Lucica Ibanescu: "How screen readers speak a 
page with HTML5 and ARIA", 24 January 2011:
   <http://cssgallery.info/how-screen-readers-speak-a-page-with-html5-and-aria/>.
[5] Jason Kiss: "HTML5, ARIA Roles, and Screen Readers in March 2011":
   <http://www.accessibleculture.org/research/html5-aria-2011/>.


At 20:20 29-6-2011, David MacDonald wrote:
>I don't think it will be long before aria-labelledby will be implemented
>fairly ubiquitously in all assistive technologies and user agents to the
>extent that <label> is...


I would say you would have to wait at least a 
year after WAI-ARIA becomes a W3C Recommendation, 
but I mislaid my crystal ball this morning ;-)

Best regards,

Christophe


At 20:20 29-6-2011, David MacDonald wrote:
>I guess there may be some government departments that are about 2 versions
>behind because they have to test every new version before installation. They
>should be using WAI ARIA browsers within a year or so...  I can't think of
>too many other scenarios...
>
>David MacDonald
>www.eramp.co
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: w3c-wai-gl-request@w3.org [mailto:w3c-wai-gl-request@w3.org] On Behalf
>Of Tina Holmboe
>Sent: June-29-11 1:33 PM
>To: David MacDonald
>Cc: 'WCAG'
>Subject: Re: F68 forbids WAI ARIA to replace label element
>
>On Wed, Jun 29, 2011 at 01:24:16PM -0400, David MacDonald wrote:
>
> > http://www.w3.org/TR/2010/NOTE-WCAG20-TECHS-20101014/F68
> >
> >
> > I think we'll need to allow for wai-aria (labelledby), while acknowledging
> > the preference to native code.
>
>  LABEL and labelledby, or LABEL, surely; but labelledby alone will
>  surely have a nasty impact on non-ARIA supporting UAs?
>
>
>--
>  Tina Holmboe            Greytower Technologies          www.greytower.net
>   CEO                    Quality and Accessibility
>www.sitesifter.co.uk
>
>   blog.greytower.net     www.twitter.com/GreytowerTech

-- 
Christophe Strobbe
K.U.Leuven - Dept. of Electrical Engineering - SCD
Research Group on Document Architectures
Kasteelpark Arenberg 10 bus 2442
B-3001 Leuven-Heverlee
BELGIUM
tel: +32 16 32 85 51
http://www.docarch.be/
Twitter: @RabelaisA11y
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Received on Friday, 1 July 2011 18:28:35 GMT

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