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Re: Tabbed navigation designs and 1.4

From: Gregg Vanderheiden <gv@trace.wisc.edu>
Date: Mon, 05 May 2008 22:10:23 -0500
To: Andi Snow-Weaver <andisnow@us.ibm.com>
Cc: WCAG <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org>
Message-id: <A34934E2-A41C-4CFC-BC59-3CACFEE8A037@trace.wisc.edu>

Hi Andi,

fortunately,  color isn't the only means for conveying information on  
this page as you point out.  The page is usable in black and white.
the fact that it changes color does make it more visually obvious if  
you can see color.  but the luminance (darkness/lightness) difference  
of the tab and the items under it are enough and are redundant with  
the hue.

So the page passes 1.4.1.



On Apr 30, 2008, at 9:32 AM, Andi Snow-Weaver wrote:

>
>
> Take a look at this website:
>
> http://www.rnib.org.uk/xpedio/groups/public/documents/code/public_rnib003460.hcsp
>
> These tabbed navigation designs are quite common on a lot of  
> websites. The
> first row of links are "tabs" and the second row is a sub-menu of the
> selected tab. The selected tab and its sub-menu are associated through
> presentation (color). ARIA will provide a way to programmatically  
> expose
> this relationship conveyed through presentation (1.3).
>
> But what about 1.4? Color is the only "visual" means of conveying  
> which tab
> is selected. But is this a problem for someone with color vision  
> deficits?
> The particular color is not relevant. It's the contrast between the  
> light
> color (yellow) and the dark color (red) that the user needs to be  
> able to
> detect.
>
> Would this example fail 1.4? Should it?
>
> Andi
>
>
>
>
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>
> Andi,
>
> But color is not the only way of indentifying the tabs (it is just  
> used as a supplementary - which is helpful for all - but can be  
> extra helpful to persons with cognitive disabilities.)
>
> The way I see it, the selected tab and its sub-menu are *first*  
> associated with text and *then* associated through presentation  
> (color).
>
> Katie
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Andi Snow-Weaver <andisnow@us.ibm.com>
>> Sent: Apr 30, 2008 10:32 AM
>> To: WCAG <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org>
>> Subject: Tabbed navigation designs and 1.4
>>
>>
>>
>> Take a look at this website:
>>
>> http://www.rnib.org.uk/xpedio/groups/public/documents/code/public_rnib003460.hcsp
>>
>> These tabbed navigation designs are quite common on a lot of  
>> websites. The
>> first row of links are "tabs" and the second row is a sub-menu of the
>> selected tab. The selected tab and its sub-menu are associated  
>> through
>> presentation (color). ARIA will provide a way to programmatically  
>> expose
>> this relationship conveyed through presentation (1.3).
>>
>> But what about 1.4? Color is the only "visual" means of conveying  
>> which tab
>> is selected. But is this a problem for someone with color vision  
>> deficits?
>> The particular color is not relevant. It's the contrast between the  
>> light
>> color (yellow) and the dark color (red) that the user needs to be  
>> able to
>> detect.
>>
>> Would this example fail 1.4? Should it?
>>
>> Andi
>>
>>
>
>
> * katie *
>
> Katie Haritos-Shea
> Section 508 Technical Policy Analyst
>
> 703-371-5545
>
> People may forget exactly what it was that you said or did,
> but they will never forget how you made them feel.......
>
>
>
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> This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
> --------------080404070108040205030505
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
> The WCAG 2.0 Candidate Recommendation has been published. Thanks to  
> the
> Working Group for all your work in getting the document to this stage.
> Thanks to Loretta, Gregg, Ben, Shawn, and Judy for a lot of work in  
> the
> publication preparation.
>
> There is a press release that accompanies this publication - see
> http://www.w3.org/2008/04/wcag20cr-pressrelease
>
> Michael
>
> -------- Original Message --------
>
> Dear WAI Interest Group Participants,
>
> The Web Content Accessibility Guidelines (WCAG) Working Group is  
> excited
> to announce the publication of WCAG 2.0 as a W3C Candidate
> Recommendation on 30 April. WCAG 2.0 explains how to make Web sites,
> applications, and other content accessible to people with  
> disabilities,
> and many elderly users.
>
>    http://www.w3.org/TR/2008/CR-WCAG20-20080430/
>
> Candidate Recommendation (CR) is a major step in the W3C standards
> development process; it signals that there is broad consensus in the
> Working Group and among public reviewers on the technical content of
> WCAG 2.0. The W3C Process stages are described in:
>
> How WAI Develops Accessibility Guidelines through the W3C Process
>
>    http://www.w3.org/WAI/intro/w3c-process
>
> The primary purpose of this CR stage is for developers and designers  
> to
> "test drive" WCAG 2.0 to demonstrate that WCAG 2.0 can be  
> implemented in
> Web sites. WAI encourages a broad range of Web sites and Web
> applications to use WCAG 2.0 at this stage, and share implementation
> experience. For information on submitting your implementations, see:
>
> WCAG 2.0 Candidate Recommendation Implementation Information
>
>    http://www.w3.org/WAI/WCAG20/CR/
>
> If you plan to provide implementations, please let us know your
> intentions by *23 May 2008*.
>
> Actual implementations are due by *30 June 2008*.
>
> It is important to note that some WCAG 2.0 requirements are at risk;
> thatis, they may not be included if there are not sufficient
> implementations. Items at risk are listed under =E2=80=9CItems at  
> Risk=E2=
> =80=9D in:
>
>    http://www.w3.org/TR/2008/CR-WCAG20-20080430/#status_risk
>
> While the focus of this stage is to collect implementations, the  
> comment
> form and email address are still available from:
>
> Instructions for Commenting on WCAG 2.0 Documents
>
>    http://www.w3.org/WAI/WCAG20/comments/
>
> The different WCAG 2.0 documents that the WCAG Working Group updated
> with this publication are introduced in:
>
> Overview of Web Content Accessibility Guidelines (WCAG) 2.0 Documents
> http://www.w3.org/WAI/intro/wcag20.php
>
> A key tool for using WCAG 2.0 documents, which was previously called  
> the
> "Quick Reference", is:
>
> How to Meet WCAG 2.0: A customizable quick reference to WCAG 2.0
> requirements...
>
>    http://www.w3.org/WAI/WCAG20/quickref/
>
> For more information about the Candidate Recommendation status of WCAG
> 2.0 and the changes since the last publication, see:
>
> "Status of this Document" section of WCAG 2.0
>
>    http://www.w3.org/TR/2008/CR-WCAG20-20080430/#status
>
> WCAG 2.0 is part of a series of accessibility guidelines/standards
> developed by WAI, which are listed in:
>
> WAI Guidelines and Techniques
>
>    http://www.w3.org/WAI/guid-tech.html
>
> Feel free to circulate this message to other lists; please avoid
> cross-postings where possible.
>
> Please let us know if you have any questions. Thank you in advance for
> your help implementing WCAG 2.0.
>
> Regards,
>
> ~Shawn Lawton Henry and Judy Brewer
>
> On behalf of:
> Loretta Guarino Reid, Co-chair of WCAG WG, and Computer Scientist,
> GoogleInc.
> Gregg Vanderheiden, Co-chair of WCAG WG, and Director of Trace R&D
> Center, University of Wisconsin-Madison
> Michael Cooper, W3C Team Contact for WCAG WG
>
> -----
>
> Shawn Lawton Henry, W3C Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI)
> about: http://www.w3.org/People/Shawn/
> phone: +1-617-395-7664
> e-mail: shawn@w3.org
>
> --=20
>
> Michael Cooper
> Web Accessibility Specialist
> World Wide Web Consortium, Web Accessibility Initiative
> E-mail cooper@w3.org <mailto:cooper@w3.org>
> Information Page <http://www.w3.org/People/cooper/>
>
>
> --------------080404070108040205030505
> Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
> <!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">
> <html>
> <head>
> </head>
> <body bgcolor=3D"#ffffff" text=3D"#000000">
> <p>The WCAG 2.0 Candidate Recommendation has been published. Thanks to
> the Working Group for all your work in getting the document to this
> stage. Thanks to Loretta, Gregg, Ben, Shawn, and Judy for a lot of  
> work
> in the publication preparation.</p>
> <p>There is a press release that accompanies this publication - see
> <a class=3D"moz-txt-link-freetext" href=3D"http://www.w3.org/2008/04/wcag=
> 20cr-pressrelease">http://www.w3.org/2008/04/wcag20cr-pressrelease</ 
> a></p=
>>
> <p>Michael</p>
> -------- Original Message --------<br>
> <p>Dear WAI Interest Group Participants,</p>
> <p>The Web Content Accessibility Guidelines (WCAG) Working Group is
> excited to announce the publication of WCAG 2.0 as a W3C Candidate
> Recommendation on 30 April. WCAG 2.0 explains how to make Web sites,
> applications, and other content accessible to people with  
> disabilities,
> and many elderly users.</p>
> <blockquote>
>  <p><a class=3D"moz-txt-link-freetext" href=3D"http://www.w3.org/TR/2008=
> /CR-WCAG20-20080430/">http://www.w3.org/TR/2008/CR-WCAG20-20080430/</ 
> a></=
> p>
> </blockquote>
> <p>Candidate Recommendation (CR) is a major step in the W3C standards
> development process; it signals that there is broad consensus in the
> Working Group and among public reviewers on the technical content of
> WCAG 2.0. The W3C Process stages are described in:</p>
> <p> How WAI Develops Accessibility Guidelines through the W3C  
> Process<br>
> </p>
> <blockquote><a class=3D"moz-txt-link-freetext" href=3D"http://www.w3.org/=
> WAI/intro/w3c-process">http://www.w3.org/WAI/intro/w3c-process</a></ 
> block=
> quote>
> <p>The primary purpose of this CR stage is for developers and  
> designers
> to "test drive" WCAG 2.0 to demonstrate that WCAG 2.0 can be
> implemented in Web sites. WAI encourages a broad range of Web sites  
> and
> Web applications to use WCAG 2.0 at this stage, and share
> implementation experience. For information on submitting your
> implementations, see:</p>
> <p> WCAG 2.0 Candidate Recommendation Implementation Information<br>
> </p>
> <blockquote><a class=3D"moz-txt-link-freetext" href=3D"http://www.w3.org/=
> WAI/WCAG20/CR/">http://www.w3.org/WAI/WCAG20/CR/</a></blockquote>
> <p>If you plan to provide implementations, please let us know your
> intentions by *23 May 2008*.</p>
> <p>Actual implementations are due by *30 June 2008*.</p>
> <p>It is important to note that some WCAG 2.0 requirements are at  
> risk;
> thatis, they may not be included if there are not sufficient
> implementations. Items at risk are listed under =E2=80=9CItems at  
> Risk=E2=
> =80=9D in:<br>
> </p>
> <blockquote><a class=3D"moz-txt-link-freetext" href=3D"http://www.w3.org/=
> TR/2008/CR-WCAG20-20080430/#status_risk">http://www.w3.org/TR/2008/CR-WCA=
> G20-20080430/#status_risk</a></blockquote>
> <p>While the focus of this stage is to collect implementations, the
> comment form and email address are still available from:</p>
> <p> Instructions for Commenting on WCAG 2.0 Documents<br>
> </p>
> <blockquote><a class=3D"moz-txt-link-freetext" href=3D"http://www.w3.org/=
> WAI/WCAG20/comments/">http://www.w3.org/WAI/WCAG20/comments/</a></ 
> blockqu=
> ote>
> <p>The different WCAG 2.0 documents that the WCAG Working Group  
> updated
> with this publication are introduced in:</p>
> <p> Overview of Web Content Accessibility Guidelines (WCAG) 2.0
> Documents<br>
> <a class=3D"moz-txt-link-freetext" href=3D"http://www.w3.org/WAI/intro/wc=
> ag20.php">http://www.w3.org/WAI/intro/wcag20.php</a></p>
> <p>A key tool for using WCAG 2.0 documents, which was previously  
> called
> the "Quick Reference", is:</p>
> <p> How to Meet WCAG 2.0: A customizable quick reference to WCAG 2.0
> requirements...<br>
> </p>
> <blockquote><a class=3D"moz-txt-link-freetext" href=3D"http://www.w3.org/=
> WAI/WCAG20/quickref/">http://www.w3.org/WAI/WCAG20/quickref/</a></ 
> blockqu=
> ote>
> <p>For more information about the Candidate Recommendation status of
> WCAG 2.0 and the changes since the last publication, see:</p>
> <p> "Status of this Document" section of WCAG 2.0<br>
> </p>
> <blockquote><a class=3D"moz-txt-link-freetext" href=3D"http://www.w3.org/=
> TR/2008/CR-WCAG20-20080430/#status">http://www.w3.org/TR/2008/CR-WCAG20-2=
> 0080430/#status</a></blockquote>
> <p>WCAG 2.0 is part of a series of accessibility guidelines/standards
> developed by WAI, which are listed in:</p>
> <p> WAI Guidelines and Techniques<br>
> </p>
> <blockquote><a class=3D"moz-txt-link-freetext" href=3D"http://www.w3.org/=
> WAI/guid-tech.html">http://www.w3.org/WAI/guid-tech.html</a></ 
> blockquote>
> <p>Feel free to circulate this message to other lists; please avoid
> cross-postings where possible.</p>
> <p>Please let us know if you have any questions. Thank you in advance
> for your help implementing WCAG 2.0.</p>
> <p>Regards,</p>
> <p>~Shawn Lawton Henry and Judy Brewer</p>
> <p>On behalf of:<br>
> Loretta Guarino Reid, Co-chair of WCAG WG, and Computer Scientist,
> GoogleInc.<br>
> Gregg Vanderheiden, Co-chair of WCAG WG, and Director of Trace R&amp;D
> Center, University of Wisconsin-Madison<br>
> Michael Cooper, W3C Team Contact for WCAG WG</p>
> <p>-----</p>
> <p>Shawn Lawton Henry, W3C Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI)<br>
> about: <a class=3D"moz-txt-link-freetext" href=3D"http://www.w3.org/Peopl=
> e/Shawn/">http://www.w3.org/People/Shawn/</a><br>
> phone: +1-617-395-7664<br>
> e-mail: <a class=3D"moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href=3D"mailto:shawn@w3.org=
> ">shawn@w3.org</a></p>
> <div class=3D"moz-signature">-- <br>
> <p>Michael Cooper<br>
> Web Accessibility Specialist<br>
> World Wide Web Consortium, Web Accessibility Initiative<br>
> <a href=3D"mailto:cooper@w3.org">E-mail cooper@w3.org</a><br>
> <a href=3D"http://www.w3.org/People/cooper/">Information Page</a></p>
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> </html>
>
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> >
> To: WCAG <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org>
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> Message-ID: <29057219.1209572512984.JavaMail.root@m06>
> From: Andi Snow-Weaver <andisnow@us.ibm.com>
> Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2008 11:19:34 -0500
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>
> Katie,
>
> How are they associated with text visually?
>
> Andi
> e
>
>
>
>             Katie
>             Haritos-Shea
>              
> <ryladog@earthlin                                          To
>             k.net>                    Andi Snow-Weaver/Austin/ 
> IBM@IBMUS,
>                                       WCAG <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org>
>             04/30/2008  
> 10:31                                           cc
>             AM
>                                                                    
> Subject
>                                       Re: Tabbed navigation designs  
> and
>             Please respond to         1.4
>                   Katie
>               Haritos-Shea
>             <ryladog@earthlin
>                  k.net>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Andi,
>
> But color is not the only way of indentifying the tabs (it is just  
> used as
> a supplementary - which is helpful for all - but can be extra  
> helpful to
> persons with cognitive disabilities.)
>
> The way I see it, the selected tab and its sub-menu are *first*  
> associated
> with text and *then* associated through presentation (color).
>
> Katie
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Andi Snow-Weaver <andisnow@us.ibm.com>
>> Sent: Apr 30, 2008 10:32 AM
>> To: WCAG <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org>
>> Subject: Tabbed navigation designs and 1.4
>>
>>
>>
>> Take a look at this website:
>>
>> http://www.rnib.org.uk/xpedio/groups/public/documents/code/public_rnib003460.hcsp
>
>>
>> These tabbed navigation designs are quite common on a lot of  
>> websites. The
>> first row of links are "tabs" and the second row is a sub-menu of the
>> selected tab. The selected tab and its sub-menu are associated  
>> through
>> presentation (color). ARIA will provide a way to programmatically  
>> expose
>> this relationship conveyed through presentation (1.3).
>>
>> But what about 1.4? Color is the only "visual" means of conveying  
>> which
> tab
>> is selected. But is this a problem for someone with color vision  
>> deficits?
>> The particular color is not relevant. It's the contrast between the  
>> light
>> color (yellow) and the dark color (red) that the user needs to be  
>> able to
>> detect.
>>
>> Would this example fail 1.4? Should it?
>>
>> Andi
>>
>>
>
>
> * katie *
>
> Katie Haritos-Shea
> Section 508 Technical Policy Analyst
>
> 703-371-5545
>
> People may forget exactly what it was that you said or did,
> but they will never forget how you made them feel.......
>
>
>
>
>
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> > <OFA94B296D.6BEDEAA1-ON8625743B.00598D2B-8625743B.0059AECF@us.ibm.com 
> >
> From: "Andrew Kirkpatrick" <akirkpat@adobe.com>
> To: "WCAG" <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org>
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>
>
> The active tab is also identified by shape (assuming sight and CSS
> support).
>
> There is a heading for the subnavigation that is "Good design submenu"
> that tells you what the selected tab is. That may be what Katie is
> referring to.
>
> AWK
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: w3c-wai-gl-request@w3.org [mailto:w3c-wai-gl-request@w3.org] On
>> Behalf Of Andi Snow-Weaver
>> Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 12:20 PM
>> To: WCAG
>> Subject: Re: Tabbed navigation designs and 1.4
>>
>>
>> Katie,
>>
>> How are they associated with text visually?
>>
>> Andi
>> e
>>
>>
>>
>>             Katie
>>             Haritos-Shea
>>             <ryladog@earthlin
>> To
>>             k.net>                    Andi Snow-
>> Weaver/Austin/IBM@IBMUS,
>>                                       WCAG <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org>
>>             04/30/2008 10:31
>> cc
>>             AM
>>
>> Subject
>>                                       Re: Tabbed navigation designs
>> and
>>             Please respond to         1.4
>>                   Katie
>>               Haritos-Shea
>>             <ryladog@earthlin
>>                  k.net>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Andi,
>>
>> But color is not the only way of indentifying the tabs (it is just
> used
>> as
>> a supplementary - which is helpful for all - but can be extra helpful
>> to
>> persons with cognitive disabilities.)
>>
>> The way I see it, the selected tab and its sub-menu are *first*
>> associated
>> with text and *then* associated through presentation (color).
>>
>> Katie
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Andi Snow-Weaver <andisnow@us.ibm.com>
>>> Sent: Apr 30, 2008 10:32 AM
>>> To: WCAG <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org>
>>> Subject: Tabbed navigation designs and 1.4
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Take a look at this website:
>>>
>>
>> http://www.rnib.org.uk/xpedio/groups/public/documents/code/ 
>> public_rnib
>> 003460.hcsp
>>
>>>
>>> These tabbed navigation designs are quite common on a lot of
> websites.
>> The
>>> first row of links are "tabs" and the second row is a sub-menu of  
>>> the
>>> selected tab. The selected tab and its sub-menu are associated
> through
>>> presentation (color). ARIA will provide a way to programmatically
>> expose
>>> this relationship conveyed through presentation (1.3).
>>>
>>> But what about 1.4? Color is the only "visual" means of conveying
>> which
>> tab
>>> is selected. But is this a problem for someone with color vision
>> deficits?
>>> The particular color is not relevant. It's the contrast between the
>> light
>>> color (yellow) and the dark color (red) that the user needs to be
> able
>> to
>>> detect.
>>>
>>> Would this example fail 1.4? Should it?
>>>
>>> Andi
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> * katie *
>>
>> Katie Haritos-Shea
>> Section 508 Technical Policy Analyst
>>
>> 703-371-5545
>>
>> People may forget exactly what it was that you said or did,
>> but they will never forget how you made them feel.......
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
> From - Mon Apr 28 23:12:54 2008
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> Subject: RE: Tabbed navigation designs and 1.4
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>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: w3c-wai-gl-request@w3.org [mailto:w3c-wai-gl-request@w3.org]  
> On Behalf
> Of Andrew Kirkpatrick
> Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 7:28 PM
> To: WCAG
> Subject: RE: Tabbed navigation designs and 1.4
>
>
> The active tab is also identified by shape (assuming sight and CSS
> support).
>
> There is a heading for the subnavigation that is "Good design submenu"
> that tells you what the selected tab is. That may be what Katie is
> referring to.
>
> Roberto Scano:
> And what about the solution that we use also to conform to a similar
> requirement in Italian Law?
> Using a title element (title="Active Menu" or title="Selected") give
> information also without colour.
>
> <ul id="siteNav">
>      <li id="optionGoodDesign"> <a
> href="/xpedio/groups/public/documents/code/public_rnib003460.hcsp"
> title="Active Menu">Good Design</a></li>
> 	<li id="optionAboutUs"> <a
> href="/xpedio/groups/public/documents/code/ 
> public_rnib001950.hcsp">About
> Us</a></li>
> 	<li id="optionEyeInfo"> <a
> href="/xpedio/groups/public/documents/code/public_rnib001959.hcsp">Eye
> Info</a></li>
> 	<li id="optionHelpUs"> <a
> href="/xpedio/groups/public/documents/code/ 
> public_rnib003465.hcsp">Support
> Us</a></li>
> 	<li id="optionDailyLife"> <a
> href="/xpedio/groups/public/documents/code/ 
> public_rnib001958.hcsp">Daily
> Life</a></li>
> 	<li id="optionShop"> <a
> href="http://onlineshop.rnib.org.uk/shoptab.asp">Shop</a></li>
>  </ul>
>
>
>
>
> From - Thu May  1 09:16:42 2008
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> Subject: RE: Tabbed navigation designs and 1.4
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>
> I am not so sure that  the text tells me  that there
> is tab navigation on the page or that a particular tab
> is selected.
> Issue with tabs:  The role and state of tabs should be
> conveyed via title attribute on anchor and hidden text
> (to support current user agents and AT). For instance,
>
> when About Us tab is selected, its title and hidden
> text  should be set to "Selected Tab 2 of 6". When any
> other tab is selected, the title for About
> us tab should be "Tab 2 of 6". The focus should remain
> on the tab link that is activated and  the screen
> reader should be
> able to read the new state of the tab. Now the focus
> goes somewhere else and one is unaware that there is a
> list of submenu
> links right under the tabs.
> I hope ARIA will be able to convey the role and state
> as described above.
> I also noted tabbing order  issues on the page: JAWS9
> and WinEyes 6.1 folllow different tabbing patterns
> with IE7.
> Thanks,
> Sailesh Panchang
> --- Andrew Kirkpatrick <akirkpat@adobe.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> The active tab is also identified by shape (assuming
>> sight and CSS
>> support).
>>
>> There is a heading for the subnavigation that is
>> "Good design submenu"
>> that tells you what the selected tab is. That may be
>> what Katie is
>> referring to.
>>
>> AWK
>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: w3c-wai-gl-request@w3.org
>> [mailto:w3c-wai-gl-request@w3.org] On
>>> Behalf Of Andi Snow-Weaver
>>> Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 12:20 PM
>>> To: WCAG
>>> Subject: Re: Tabbed navigation designs and 1.4
>>>
>>>
>>> Katie,
>>>
>>> How are they associated with text visually?
>>>
>>> Andi
>>> e
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>             Katie
>>>             Haritos-Shea
>>>             <ryladog@earthlin
>>> To
>>>             k.net>                    Andi Snow-
>>> Weaver/Austin/IBM@IBMUS,
>>>                                       WCAG
>> <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org>
>>>             04/30/2008 10:31
>>> cc
>>>             AM
>>>
>>> Subject
>>>                                       Re: Tabbed
>> navigation designs
>>> and
>>>             Please respond to         1.4
>>>                   Katie
>>>               Haritos-Shea
>>>             <ryladog@earthlin
>>>                  k.net>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Andi,
>>>
>>> But color is not the only way of indentifying the
>> tabs (it is just
>> used
>>> as
>>> a supplementary - which is helpful for all - but
>> can be extra helpful
>>> to
>>> persons with cognitive disabilities.)
>>>
>>> The way I see it, the selected tab and its
>> sub-menu are *first*
>>> associated
>>> with text and *then* associated through
>> presentation (color).
>>>
>>> Katie
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Andi Snow-Weaver <andisnow@us.ibm.com>
>>>> Sent: Apr 30, 2008 10:32 AM
>>>> To: WCAG <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org>
>>>> Subject: Tabbed navigation designs and 1.4
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Take a look at this website:
>>>>
>>>
>>
>> http://www.rnib.org.uk/xpedio/groups/public/documents/code/ 
>> public_rnib
>>> 003460.hcsp
>>>
>>>>
>>>> These tabbed navigation designs are quite common
>> on a lot of
>> websites.
>>> The
>>>> first row of links are "tabs" and the second row
>> is a sub-menu of the
>>>> selected tab. The selected tab and its sub-menu
>> are associated
>> through
>>>> presentation (color). ARIA will provide a way to
>> programmatically
>>> expose
>>>> this relationship conveyed through presentation
>> (1.3).
>>>>
>>>> But what about 1.4? Color is the only "visual"
>> means of conveying
>>> which
>>> tab
>>>> is selected. But is this a problem for someone
>> with color vision
>>> deficits?
>>>> The particular color is not relevant. It's the
>> contrast between the
>>> light
>>>> color (yellow) and the dark color (red) that the
>> user needs to be
>> able
>>> to
>>>> detect.
>>>>
>>>> Would this example fail 1.4? Should it?
>>>>
>>>> Andi
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> * katie *
>>>
>>> Katie Haritos-Shea
>>> Section 508 Technical Policy Analyst
>>>
>>> 703-371-5545
>>>
>>> People may forget exactly what it was that you
>> said or did,
>>> but they will never forget how you made them
>> feel.......
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>       
> ____________________________________________________________________________________
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> know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile.  Try it now.  http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
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>
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> Subject: RE: Tabbed navigation designs and 1.4
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>
> Okay, the shape is the redundant visual cue. Duh.
>
> The heading is hidden so it only works for AT users and helps with  
> 1.3.1.
> but not 1.4.1.
>
> Andi
>
>
>
>
>             "Andrew
>             Kirkpatrick"
>              
> <akirkpat@adobe.c                                          To
>             om>                       "WCAG" <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org>
>             Sent  
> by:                                                   cc
>             w3c-wai-gl-reques
>             t@w3.org                                               
> Subject
>                                       RE: Tabbed navigation designs  
> and
>                                       1.4
>             04/30/2008 12:28
>             PM
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> The active tab is also identified by shape (assuming sight and CSS
> support).
>
> There is a heading for the subnavigation that is "Good design submenu"
> that tells you what the selected tab is. That may be what Katie is
> referring to.
>
> AWK
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: w3c-wai-gl-request@w3.org [mailto:w3c-wai-gl-request@w3.org] On
>> Behalf Of Andi Snow-Weaver
>> Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 12:20 PM
>> To: WCAG
>> Subject: Re: Tabbed navigation designs and 1.4
>>
>>
>> Katie,
>>
>> How are they associated with text visually?
>>
>> Andi
>> e
>>
>>
>>
>>             Katie
>>             Haritos-Shea
>>             <ryladog@earthlin
>> To
>>             k.net>                    Andi Snow-
>> Weaver/Austin/IBM@IBMUS,
>>                                       WCAG <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org>
>>             04/30/2008 10:31
>> cc
>>             AM
>>
>> Subject
>>                                       Re: Tabbed navigation designs
>> and
>>             Please respond to         1.4
>>                   Katie
>>               Haritos-Shea
>>             <ryladog@earthlin
>>                  k.net>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Andi,
>>
>> But color is not the only way of indentifying the tabs (it is just
> used
>> as
>> a supplementary - which is helpful for all - but can be extra helpful
>> to
>> persons with cognitive disabilities.)
>>
>> The way I see it, the selected tab and its sub-menu are *first*
>> associated
>> with text and *then* associated through presentation (color).
>>
>> Katie
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Andi Snow-Weaver <andisnow@us.ibm.com>
>>> Sent: Apr 30, 2008 10:32 AM
>>> To: WCAG <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org>
>>> Subject: Tabbed navigation designs and 1.4
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Take a look at this website:
>>>
>>
>> http://www.rnib.org.uk/xpedio/groups/public/documents/code/ 
>> public_rnib
>> 003460.hcsp
>>
>>>
>>> These tabbed navigation designs are quite common on a lot of
> websites.
>> The
>>> first row of links are "tabs" and the second row is a sub-menu of  
>>> the
>>> selected tab. The selected tab and its sub-menu are associated
> through
>>> presentation (color). ARIA will provide a way to programmatically
>> expose
>>> this relationship conveyed through presentation (1.3).
>>>
>>> But what about 1.4? Color is the only "visual" means of conveying
>> which
>> tab
>>> is selected. But is this a problem for someone with color vision
>> deficits?
>>> The particular color is not relevant. It's the contrast between the
>> light
>>> color (yellow) and the dark color (red) that the user needs to be
> able
>> to
>>> detect.
>>>
>>> Would this example fail 1.4? Should it?
>>>
>>> Andi
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> * katie *
>>
>> Katie Haritos-Shea
>> Section 508 Technical Policy Analyst
>>
>> 703-371-5545
>>
>> People may forget exactly what it was that you said or did,
>> but they will never forget how you made them feel.......
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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