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Re: 24 August 2006 Agenda

From: Gez Lemon <gez.lemon@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 18:04:43 +0100
Message-ID: <e2a28a920608231004u50cdcc45w8c30cbe6b1efa84@mail.gmail.com>
To: "Bailey, Bruce" <Bruce.Bailey@ed.gov>
Cc: w3c-wai-gl@w3.org

On 23/08/06, Bailey, Bruce <Bruce.Bailey@ed.gov> wrote:
> The number of keystrokes aside, the Mozilla approach seems
> sound.  What if that were reduced to a single hot key
> combination?

Yes, the Mozilla approach is at least in the right direction. I'm not
even convinced it's the number of keystrokes that is the issue - the
user would still be forced to investigate every interface element they
came across.

> I believe it is a mistake to use title just for the benefit of
> screen readers.  I am in favor of using title as supplemental
> information that can be available upon demand to *everyone*.

<snip>

> Requiring redundant information in the title, to make up for known
> defects in the AT, does not seem like a viable *long term* solution
> to me.

I couldn't agree more.

> The best way for the browser (and AT) to expose the availability
> of a title is subject to debate, but I don't think title should be
> there just for an AT user.  I am not sure it is a reasonable
> expectation for the screen reader to expose the title value
> all the time.

Again, I completely agree;  particularly considering the title
attribute is also used by unscrupulous search engine optimizers. If
the information is truly supplementary, then the title attribute is a
good choice, but not as a means for imparting important information.

> Since people with disabilities may disproportionately
> benefit from the supplemental information, I regard it
> as the correct domain of WCAG to include the technique.

I expect this is where we differ. I think it would make a great
advisory technique, but I don't think it is sufficient to rely on it.
Adhering to success criteria using something intended to be
supplementary seems paradoxical to me. It's not reasonable to expect
people to investigate every interface element they encounter to find
out if there are additional instructions/clauses they should be aware
of.

> Are you asking only about form elements?  I am not clear
> how robust WindowEyes is with the label tag.  I do not believe
> WindowEyes exposes title attribute values on form elements
> under *any* circumstances.

I was referring to form elements; in particular, form elements that
don't have a proper label. I don't have have access to Windows Eyes,
and even if I did, I wouldn't have a clue how to use it, but I've been
under the impression that Windows Eyes will announce title text in the
absence of a proper label.

Best regards,

Gez


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Received on Wednesday, 23 August 2006 17:05:04 GMT

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