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RE: embed (was NEW: Issue #1783)

From: Michael Cooper <michaelc@watchfire.com>
Date: Fri, 9 Dec 2005 11:55:30 -0500
Message-ID: <A0666B3C59F1634290FDC88674D87C3206620530@1WFEMAIL.ottawa.watchfire.com>
To: "Christophe Strobbe" <christophe.strobbe@esat.kuleuven.be>, <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org>

Hi Christophe - I think I proposed the <embed> techniques so I thought
I'd provide background on where they came from. I used a resource called
HTML Compendium <http://htmlcompendium.org/> that listed all known HTML
elements and attributes, whether or not they were officially in spec,
and indicated known user agent support for them. This resource indicated
that "alt" on <embed>, and <noembed> either inside or outside the
<embed> element, were known and supported. However, when I last looked
at the site a year ago it was transitioning from a free to a commercial
resource and now appears to be completely unavailable and/or taken over
by a completely different organization. Pot calling the kettle black so
I don't have a moral right to complain, but I am now unable to provide
the data to back up what I just said. Since the specs you looked at are
not fully conclusive I think we can't answer the question without doing
some browser testing ourselves. Michael

-----Original Message-----
From: w3c-wai-gl-request@w3.org [mailto:w3c-wai-gl-request@w3.org] On
Behalf Of Christophe Strobbe
Sent: Friday, December 09, 2005 8:39 AM
To: w3c-wai-gl@w3.org
Subject: embed (was NEW: Issue #1783)



In issue 1783 [http://trace.wisc.edu/bugzilla_wcag/show_bug.cgi?id=1783]

Simon Pieters comments on the editorial note on HTML technique H64 ("Is
it 
true that noembed can go either beside or inside embed? Is there a 
preference?"), claiming that embed is an empty element type. However,
embed 
is a proprietary extension of HTML, so the truth of such claims depends
on 
the implementation.
In Netscape's documentation 
[http://devedge-temp.mozilla.org/library/manuals/1998/htmlguide/tags14.h
tml#1286379], 
the syntax suggests that there can be content inside the start and end
tag, 
but the example uses empty element notation (although this is not 100% 
certain without a DTD).
In Microsoft's documentation 
[http://msdn.microsoft.com/workshop/author/dhtml/reference/objects/embed
.asp] 
does not state whether it is an empty element or not; the statement that

"This element does not require a closing tag." is inconclusive in this
regard.
(J.J. Solari's custom DTD 
[http://www.yoyodesign.org/doc/dtd/xhtml1-embed.html.en#add2] allows 
noembed and other content to appear inside embed, but that does not 
constitute evidence.)
It appears that we need better information from browser manufacturers to

solve the question in the editorial note.

Regards,

Christophe Strobbe


-- 
Christophe Strobbe
K.U.Leuven - Departement of Electrical Engineering - Research Group on 
Document Architectures
Kasteelpark Arenberg 10 - 3001 Leuven-Heverlee - BELGIUM
tel: +32 16 32 85 51
http://www.docarch.be/ 


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Received on Friday, 9 December 2005 16:57:36 GMT

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