RE: [#293] Summary for tables

Our mission is not to provide authors flexibility, but rather, to
constrict them to produce materials that are accessible. If we deviate
from this objective we are doing a disservice.

Chris Brainerd
Instructional Designer
Real Choices ACCESS
Center on Disability Studies
University of Hawaii
Chris.brainerd@cds.hawaii.edu
808-956-9356

-----Original Message-----
From: Chris Ridpath [mailto:chris.ridpath@utoronto.ca] 
Sent: Thursday, July 17, 2003 10:38 AM
To: gv@trace.wisc.edu; 'Charles McCathieNevile'
Cc: 'WAI GL'
Subject: Re: [#293] Summary for tables



> But in general, notifying people that you didn't do something should 
> not be equivalent to doing it.
>
Yes, I agree. I'd just like to make sure that we allow the author
maximum flexibility.

Here are some common examples where notification is used to override the
current guidelines:

* A link that opens a popup window, notifies the user.

* A video presentation that flashes warns the user pre linking and at
the start of the page.

* Notification of specific requirements for access to controlled
intranets. (e.g. Jaws 4 is required for our internal site. If you have a
lower version of Jaws then ask the I.T. dept. for an upgrade).

I think you must make an effort to comply before the notification.

Chris


----- Original Message -----
From: "Gregg Vanderheiden" <gv@trace.wisc.edu>
To: "'Chris Ridpath'" <chris.ridpath@utoronto.ca>; "'Charles
McCathieNevile'" <charles@w3.org>
Cc: "'WAI GL'" <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org>
Sent: Thursday, July 17, 2003 3:26 PM
Subject: RE: [#293] Summary for tables


> Chris wrote:
> My argument is that we should, as much as possible, provide a way for 
> authors to override our guidelines as long as they notify the 
> audience.
>
> I guess this is ok.  But you shouldn't be able to declare something as

> accessible just by notifying people that you aren't making it 
> accessible. In some places, where it is unavoidable, it is a good 
> second level safety net. But in general, notifying people that you 
> didn't do something should not be equivalent to doing it.
>
> Gregg
>
>
>
>
> Gregg
>
>  -- ------------------------------
> Gregg C Vanderheiden Ph.D.
> Professor - Ind. Engr. & BioMed Engr.
> Director - Trace R & D Center
> University of Wisconsin-Madison
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: w3c-wai-gl-request@w3.org [mailto:w3c-wai-gl-request@w3.org] On
Behalf
> Of Chris Ridpath
> Sent: Thursday, July 17, 2003 11:30 AM
> To: Charles McCathieNevile
> Cc: WAI GL
> Subject: Re: [#293] Summary for tables
> Importance: High
>
>
> > >My argument is that we should, as much as possible, provide a way 
> > >for authors to override our guidelines while still keeping their 
> > >pages accessible.
> >
>
> Not quite right. I should have expressed this as:
>
> My argument is that we should, as much as possible, provide a way for 
> authors to override our guidelines as long as they notify the 
> audience.
>
> Example 1:
> Guidelines say there must be good text/background contrast. Author 
> uses yellow text on white background and states "I want this text
to
> be difficult to read because of <some artistic reason>".
>
> Example 2:
> Guidelines say there should be clear navigation.
> Author has porously confusing navigation and states "Navigation is
confusing
> because I want you to wander around."
>
> Example 3:
> Guidelines say content should be understandable.
> Author creates easily misunderstood content and states "I am an
anarchist -
> deal with it."
>
> Regarding the TH rule: If you really want to have THs in your layout 
> table then you can. Just explicitly state that this is a layout table.
>
> Chris
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Charles McCathieNevile" <charles@w3.org>
> To: "Chris Ridpath" <chris.ridpath@utoronto.ca>
> Cc: "WAI GL" <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org>
> Sent: Thursday, July 17, 2003 11:46 AM
> Subject: Re: [#293] Summary for tables
>
>
> > On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Chris Ridpath wrote:
> >
> > >My argument is that we should, as much as possible, provide a way 
> > >for authors to override our guidelines while still keeping their 
> > >pages accessible.
> >
> > I don't understand this at all. If an author can contravene the
guidelines
> > and still produce accessible content surely the guidelines should be
> changed,
> > no?
> >
> > Chaals
> >
>