W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > w3c-wai-gl@w3.org > July to September 2001

Re: User and user needs conflict- BIG ISSUES REMAINING TO BE DISCUSSED

From: Kynn Bartlett <kynn-edapta@idyllmtn.com>
Date: Sun, 30 Sep 2001 18:01:33 -0700
Message-Id: <a05100308b7dd6fc59ca1@[10.0.1.21]>
To: "Jim Ley" <jim@jibbering.com>, "Lisa Seeman" <seeman@netvision.net.il>, <jasonw@ariel.ucs.unimelb.edu.au>
Cc: <gv@trace.wisc.edu>, "_W3C-WAI Web Content Access. Guidelines List" <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org>
At 11:02 PM +0100 2001/9/30, Jim Ley wrote:
>  > Lets take a table layout, not good for some who have old screen readers,
>>  that just read strait across the page or have  linearization problems.
>
>Script or not using tables could be used to solve this, how many of these
>screen readers are there really in use whereby they have screen readers
>who can't manage that, for windows I could write a table reader in about
>an hour, would be about a 5k download and cost nothing, if there are
>really are users with that limitation, please put me in touch I could help
>them a lot...

It would also be trivial to write a proxy that changes tables into CSS
which could be accessed by people with screenreaders -- screenreaders
which don't linearize properly are, in my opinion, a Solved Problem.

Now, that doesn't mean _tables which don't linearize properly_ aren't
still a problem, and by that I mean poor HTML coding.  I myself have
been guilty of that in the past, once with a proposed redesign for an
employer's site, which went:

START OF TABLE

ROW ONE:

CELL ONE:

Header A

CELL TWO:

Header B

CELL THREE:

Header C

ROW TWO:

CELL ONE:

List of items in category A

CELL TWO:

List of items in category B

CELL THREE:

List of items in category C

END OF TABLE

Now, if you'll notice, that's actually fairly "correct" HTML.  It's not
really broken via spec, but it's borken when it comes to interpretation
by screenreader.

(It's actually a limitation both of HTML and of screenreaders that the
above didn't work correctly; the screenreaders can't take the full blame
because the HTML spec is far too loose for the kind of data association
we need here.  More on this if I can make Reef's single authoring markup
languages public.)

--Kynn

-- 
Kynn Bartlett <kynn@reef.com>
Technical Developer Liaison
Reef North America
Accessibility - W3C - Integrator Network
________________________________________
BUSINESS IS DYNAMIC. TAKE CONTROL.
________________________________________
http://www.reef.com
Received on Sunday, 30 September 2001 22:13:47 GMT

This archive was generated by hypermail 2.2.0+W3C-0.50 : Monday, 7 December 2009 10:47:14 GMT