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Re: NOFRAMES (was:Re: Techniques Document)

From: Al Gilman <asgilman@access.digex.net>
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 14:54:43 -0400 (EDT)
Message-Id: <199809111854.OAA22076@access5.digex.net>
To: w3c-wai-gl@w3.org
If the HTML "document" is designed to occupy a frame in a
frameset, and relies on another frame for navbar context, then it
would make sense to put a navbar in a NOFRAMES footer section.
One might even put header and footer NOFRAMES sections in such an
HTML thing.  Header and footer are cropped in the framed
presentation, displayed in frame-free presentation.

<just to make trouble>

Al

to follow up on what Ian Jacobs said:
> From w3c-wai-gl-request@w3.org  Tue Sep  8 13:01:39 1998
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> Date: Mon, 07 Sep 1998 22:25:44 -0400
> From: Ian Jacobs <ij@w3.org>
> Organization: W3C - World Wide Web Consortium
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> To: nir.dagan@econ.upf.es
> CC: chisholm@trace.wisc.edu, w3c-wai-gl@w3.org
> References: <H0000e2200b29430@MHS>
> Subject: Re: NOFRAMES (was:Re: Techniques Document)
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> nir.dagan@econ.upf.es wrote:
> > 
> > The NOFRAMES element appears in the DTD of regular
> > documents (loose.dtd), but has no function according
> > to the HTML4.0 spec.
> 
> I don't understand what you mean by this statement.
>  
> > The reason for this strange situation is historical.
> > Until and including the proposed recommendation of HTML4.0
> > there was a paragraph in the spec. suggesting that using NOFRAMES
> > element in a regular document means that the browser has to show
> > the content if the page is not rendered "framed", but hide it when
> > the document is "framed".
> > 
> > This was ommitted from the recommendation, but the DTD
> > was left without change.
> 
> >From section 16.4.1 of the HTML 4.0 specification:
> 
> <BLOCKQUOTE>
> The NOFRAMES element specifies content that should be
> displayed only when frames are not being displayed.
> User agents that support frames must only display 
> the contents of a NOFRAMES declaration when configured 
> not to display frames. User agents that do not support 
> frames must display the contents of NOFRAMES in any case. 
> </BLOCKQUOTE>
>  
> > As far as WAI recommendation, I think we shouldn't recommend
> > using NOFRAMES in regular documents, but only in frameset.
> 
> Can you give me further information on what you mean?
> 
>  - Ian
> 
> -- 
> Ian Jacobs (jacobs@w3.org) 
> Tel/Fax: (212) 684-1814 
> http://www.w3.org/People/Jacobs
> 
> 
Received on Friday, 11 September 1998 14:54:20 GMT

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