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RE: Forms and Labels problem

From: Wendy A Chisholm <chisholm@trace.wisc.edu>
Date: Tue, 07 Apr 1998 16:03:47 -0500
Message-Id: <199804072103.QAA12987@trace.wisc.edu>
To: "Charles (Chuck) Oppermann" <chuckop@MICROSOFT.com>
Cc: josh@zafu.com, w3c-wai-gl@w3.org
yes, we're discussing the label element and explicitly associating it with
its control.
for example, text input fields (example given in guidelines).

the problem we are trying to avoid is confusing authors so that they create
a <label> to associate with 
a button.  This would be a problem since, as you pointed out, a button
implicitly has a label that
is displayed on its face (its "name").  A button could also have alt-text
associated with it.  Thus, it 
is not necessary for an author to create a label and associate it with a

we need to ensure that the guidelines are not misleading and authors don't
create extra work
for themselves.

At 03:42 PM 4/7/98 , Charles (Chuck) Oppermann wrote:
>By labels do you mean the <label> tag?  Buttons by definition have labels,
>the text inside of them.  TYPE=IMAGE buttons can have ALT text.  
>Charles Oppermann
>Program Manager, Active Accessibility, Microsoft Corporation
> <mailto:chuckop@microsoft.com> mailto:chuckop@microsoft.com
><http://microsoft.com/enable/> http://microsoft.com/enable/
>"A computer on every desk and in every home, usable by everyone!"
>		-----Original Message-----
>		From:	Wendy A Chisholm [mailto:chisholm@trace.wisc.edu]
>		Sent:	Tuesday, April 07, 1998 9:51 AM
>		To:	josh@zafu.com
>		Cc:	w3c-wai-gl@w3.org
>		Subject:	Re: Forms and Labels problem
>		Do you think that if a control does not have a label that an
>author might
>		create one to satisfy the recommendation?  If so, we might
>want to include
>		a submit button with out a label in the example and follow
>it with a
>		statement along the lines of:
>		  This guideline does not apply to controls that do not have
>labels such as
>		submit buttons and hidden controls.
>		(or in the positive:  This guideline only applies to
>controls that have
>		labels and not to controls such as submit buttons and hidden
>		However, since we don't require every control to have a
>label, it might not
>		be a problem.   it's perfectly clear to me <smile>
>		thoughts?
>		--wendy
>		At 11:06 AM 4/7/98 , Josh Krieger wrote:
>		>In regards to: 10.2. Explicitly associate labels with their
>		>
>		>It is problematic to require people to associate LABELs
>		><INPUT TYPE=SUBMIT> buttons and BUTTONs primarily because
>		>controls often have no text to associate with them. Should
>		>we be requiring empty LABELs or none at all?
>		>
>		>There is also the sly <INPUT TYPE=HIDDEN> which shouldn't
>		>be required to have a LABEL associated with it.
>		>
>		>Josh Krieger
>		> 
>		wendy chisholm
>		human factors engineer
>		trace research and development center
>		university of wisconsin - madison, USA
wendy chisholm
human factors engineer
trace research and development center
university of wisconsin - madison, USA
Received on Tuesday, 7 April 1998 17:06:59 UTC

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