W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > semantic-web@w3.org > September 2009

Re: Linked Data Mash-a-thon

From: Benjamin Nowack <bnowack@semsol.com>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 18:32:33 +0200
To: Juan Sequeda <juanfederico@gmail.com>
Cc: Semantic Web <semantic-web@w3.org>
Message-ID: <PM-GA.20090917183233.1B83C.2.1D@semsol.com>
On 17.09.2009 08:14:45, Juan Sequeda wrote:
>Let me rephrase: I urge everybody to try to explain what Linked Data and the
>Semantic Web is to 

> 1) web developer
* Think MVC, but you can have lots of models, and these models can be 
  dynamic, and distributed across the web, transparently.
* Think RDBMS, but your schema can evolve at run-time, possibly user-driven.
* Think SQL, but without the clumsy table JOIN syntax
* Think agile web development, but add some people who have already 
  populated and made available the database your app needs, for free.
* Imagine all the cool Web 2.0 apps using a common API.
* Less custom code.
* We are still a very small community, contributions have a relatively
  high impact.

> 2) CEO
* Think Enterprise 2.0, but without the usual information loss and
  chaos when the systems grow.
* Think simplified information integration across company boundaries.
* Think cost-efficient intranet apps that can directly reuse each 
  other's data.
* Be aware of the lack of developers and education resources

> 3) VC investors
* Think real-time streams + smart filtering + personalization (or
  some other trendy *use case* for semweb tech).
* It's a set of technology standards that can boost network 
  effects and reduce costs. The startups you invest in should 
  benefit from (and stimulate) these network effects already today.

> 4) my parents
* Think Google, but with all the nice filters, views, and options 
  that Amazon has.
 
> 5) Oprah!
* Think Tom Cruise, but double the excitement.

More seriously, I think one mistake we often make is explaining the 
SemWeb as exact and complete as possible. This is not only extremely
hard, but also leaves little to no room for developer creativity or 
imagination. Something like "AJAX gives you interactive page sections"
will attract me more than "AJAX stands for ... It uses JavaScript to 
open server connections and ... Results are injected via DOM 
manipulation". I'm going to look up that 2nd explanation sooner or 
later, sure, but only if the 1st one caught my attention. Same with 
the Semantic Web. Our bootstrap pitches probably shouldn't contain 
URI, RDF, or Linked Data, but highlight addressed problems. The best
pitches are still product pitches, though. The hack-a-thon is a 
great idea!

Benji

--
Benjamin Nowack
http://bnode.org/
http://semsol.com/

>
>Juan Sequeda, Ph.D Student
>Dept. of Computer Sciences
>The University of Texas at Austin
>www.juansequeda.com
>www.semanticwebaustin.org
>
>
>On Thu, Sep 17, 2009 at 8:09 AM, Corey Leong <cleong@gr8c.org> wrote:
>
>> Juan --
>>
>> It's rather simple.  To convey what linked data is to the outside
>> bubblers, we simply need to have Oprah understand it.
>>
>> Before Oprah tweeted on her show, Twitter was used by the early
>> adopters, sorry I don't have the number offhand.
>>
>> After Oprah got it, Twitter went/is everywhere.
>>
>> If Oprah doesn't understand Mesh, Hack, etc, then the outsiders won't get
>> it.
>>
>> Hopefully this gave a few a chuckle or made a bit of sense.
>>
>> Corey
>>
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Sep 16, 2009 at 5:21 PM, Juan Sequeda <juanfederico@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> > Wow. I was in a meeting for 2 hours and my email got flooded.
>> >
>> > I'm glad that this discussion came up, but I don't think this is such a
>> big
>> > deal.
>> >
>> > First of all. I thought to myself (and sorry for being repetitive), if
>> the
>> > gurus of the semantic web are together for 5 days, how about we take
>> > advantage of that and do something cool. I know that ISWC is a
>> > research/academic conference and understand that the term "hacking" may
>> not
>> > be well received.   But cool for whom?
>> >
>> > Kingsley said: Linked Data meme is not about programmers solely. Its
>> > supposed to be inherently inclusive :-)
>> >
>> > For everybody who is not inclusive!.. which IMHO.. is about everybody
>> else
>> > except the semantic web community. We (the semantic web community) live
>> in a
>> > bubble (there, I said it!). If you talk to people outside our bubble (the
>> > rest of the world), they think we are crazy. I know Kingsley will cut
>> right
>> > in and object to what I am saying but this is my real life example. FYI,
>> > I've started the Semantic Web Austin group, we are now a non-profit, we
>> have
>> > industry partners, advisory board members  so I can say that "selling"
>> the
>> > semantic web in order to get support is HARD because we, the people in
>> the
>> > bubble, have not been able to convey the semantic web to the mainstream.
>> I
>> > urge everybody to try to explain what Linked Data and the Semantic Web is
>> 1)
>> > web developer 2) CEO 3) VC investors 4) my parents! If they can all
>> > understand, I want to know what you told them. I still haven't been able
>> to
>> > do this successfully.
>> >
>> > We need to bridge the semantic web community with the rest of the world.
>> > Linked Data is starting to get traction, but we still don't have cool
>> things
>> > that can show 1) web developer 2) CEO 3) VC investors 4) my parents! Well
>> > actually, http://dbpedia.neofonie.de/ this is really cool that all 4
>> groups
>> > would see a value. So... can we get, as Giovanni says "those that instead
>> > "would get bored otherwise" usually funnel into these things", to build
>> > something cool?
>> >
>> > Pat Hayes said: How about calling it a  Data Link-a-thon ?
>> >
>> > I don't know how much this would imply of linking data, but I like the
>> name.
>> >
>> > Giovanni Tummarello said:p.s. as i was saying to juan i might be able to
>> put
>> > some $$$ for a prize if we really do it (need to check with accounting)
>> >
>> > Wow, that would be awesome!
>> >
>> > Hopefully we can come up with a neutral name that ISWC organizers can
>> accept
>> >
>> >
>> > Juan Sequeda, Ph.D Student
>> > Dept. of Computer Sciences
>> > The University of Texas at Austin
>> > www.juansequeda.com
>> > www.semanticwebaustin.org
>> >
>> >
>> > On Wed, Sep 16, 2009 at 3:36 PM, Kingsley Idehen <kidehen@openlinksw.com
>> >
>> > wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Brian Manley wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> On Sep 16, 2009, at 11:48 AM, Kingsley Idehen wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>> Juan Sequeda wrote:
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> The objective of this idea is to show that cool things can be done
>> with
>> >>>>> Linked Data, and lets take advantage that the semantic web hackers
>> are all
>> >>>>> together at the same place.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Objective was clear, my gripe was the regressive theme of data
>> mashing.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> In other words, lets rephrase this: a Linked Data Hack-a-thon
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Why Hack when you can Mesh?
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Hacking is overrated, overloaded, and easily miscontrued, seriously
>> :-)
>> >>>>
>> >>>
>> >>> Kingsley, I find it rather ironic that someone whose cryptic,
>> >>> buzzword-overloaded, often unparsable messages here, on his blog and on
>> >>> twitter would complain about misconstrued terms or
>> less-than-crystal-clear
>> >>> communication.
>> >>
>> >> As context improves on the Web my messages will be clearer. The great
>> >> thing is that I won't even have to edit (bar typos), they'll just get
>> >> clearer :-)
>> >>>
>> >>> If Juan wants to call it a Mashup, Hack-a-thon, or whatever...who
>> cares?
>> >>
>> >> Some do, its an event aimed at an audience. And audience in this context
>> >> is supposed to imply: burgeoning pool of Linked Data meme enthusiasts.
>> >>>
>> >>>> Do Data Architects, Systems Designers, Data Integrators, and people
>> with
>> >>>> other data oriented technical skill sets not have a look-in here? I
>> don't
>> >>>> think these profiles gravitate to events that carry the  "Hacking"
>> theme.
>> >>>>
>> >>>
>> >>> Hell yeah, "hacking" is great term to use. Don't be such a stick in the
>> >>> mud. ;)
>> >>
>> >> I am a proud "stick in the mud" re. this matter.  I would like this
>> >> community to pay attention to "inclusion".
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Kingsley
>> >>>
>> >>>> Kingsley
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Juan Sequeda, Ph.D Student
>> >>>>> Dept. of Computer Sciences
>> >>>>> The University of Texas at Austin
>> >>>>> www.juansequeda.com <http://www.juansequeda.com>
>> >>>>> www.semanticwebaustin.org <http://www.semanticwebaustin.org>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> On Wed, Sep 16, 2009 at 10:20 AM, Kingsley Idehen
>> >>>>> <kidehen@openlinksw.com <mailto:kidehen@openlinksw.com>> wrote:
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>   Juan Sequeda wrote:
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>       Hi everybody,
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>       Chatting with John Goodwin, and idea came up of organizing a
>> >>>>>       Linked Data mash-a-thon during ISWC. There is a lot of Linked
>> >>>>>       Data out there, enough tools to do cool stuff, and this is the
>> >>>>>       biggest semantic web meeting, so why not show the world the
>> >>>>>       cool things that can be done with Linked Data, in a short
>> >>>>>       period of time. I haven't thought about details, but this
>> >>>>>       could run for the whole conference, or have an afternoon
>> >>>>>       session where everybody comes in and codes up an mashup. We
>> >>>>>       can then showcase what we have done as 1 min lightning talks.
>> >>>>>       My objective is to get people out of this community excited
>> >>>>>       about Linked Data and what they can do with it.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>       Anybody interested in participating and/or helping organize.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>       Juan Sequeda, Ph.D Student
>> >>>>>       Dept. of Computer Sciences
>> >>>>>       The University of Texas at Austin
>> >>>>>       www.juansequeda.com <http://www.juansequeda.com>
>> >>>>>       <http://www.juansequeda.com>
>> >>>>>       www.semanticwebaustin.org <http://www.semanticwebaustin.org>
>> >>>>>       <http://www.semanticwebaustin.org>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>   Why Mash-a-thon when Linked Data is ultimately about Data Meshing?
>> >>>>>   Words matter a great deal when introducing critical stages of
>> >>>>>   evolution witning any innovation continuum (which includes the
>> >>>>>   Web), really.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>   You don't need Linked Data for Mashups. The literal realm of Web
>> >>>>>   2.0 technologies handle that fine.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>   Linked Data is supposed to be about addressing those things aren't
>> >>>>>   handled by Mashups -- which are simply about brute force
>> >>>>>   presentation layer confined data recombinations, with code at the
>> >>>>>   terminal.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>   I would only be interested in a Linked Data oriented Mesh-a-thon
>> :-)
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>   --
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>   Regards,
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>   Kingsley Idehen       Weblog:
>> >>>>>
>http://www.openlinksw.com/blog/~kidehen<http://www.openlinksw.com/blog/%7Ekidehen>
>> >>>>>   <http://www.openlinksw.com/blog/%7Ekidehen>
>> >>>>>   President & CEO OpenLink Software     Web:
>> http://www.openlinksw.com
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>> --
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Regards,
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Kingsley Idehen          Weblog:
>> http://www.openlinksw.com/blog/~kidehen<http://www.openlinksw.com/blog/%7Ekidehen>
>> >>>> President & CEO OpenLink Software     Web: http://www.openlinksw.com
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Regards,
>> >>
>> >> Kingsley Idehen       Weblog:
>http://www.openlinksw.com/blog/~kidehen<http://www.openlinksw.com/blog/%7Ekidehen>
>> >> President & CEO OpenLink Software     Web: http://www.openlinksw.com
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Corey Leong
>> Executive Director
>> Global Real Estate And Technology Consortium (GR8C)
>> PO Box 691871
>> Orlando, FL 32869
>>
>> web:     http://gr8c.org
>> mobile:  +1 407 963 5209
>> skype:   gr8consortium
>> email:   cleong@gr8c.org
>> sl:      Neo Prinz
>> myspace: http://myspace.com/gr8consortium
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>> identi.ca: http://identi.ca/gr8c
>>
Received on Thursday, 17 September 2009 16:33:24 UTC

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