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Re: Matter of DN and what's possible

From: Henry Story <henry.story@bblfish.net>
Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2012 17:03:57 +0100
Cc: public-xg-webid@w3.org
Message-Id: <2AB52C27-C4C4-4A59-A050-6202A5E972B3@bblfish.net>
To: Kingsley Idehen <kidehen@openlinksw.com>

On 9 Jan 2012, at 16:32, Kingsley Idehen wrote:

> On 1/9/12 10:15 AM, Henry Story wrote:
>> On 9 Jan 2012, at 15:20, Kingsley Idehen wrote:
>> 
>>> On 1/9/12 8:35 AM, Henry Story wrote:
>>>> On 9 Jan 2012, at 14:06, Kingsley Idehen wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> On 1/9/12 7:20 AM, Mo McRoberts wrote:
>>>>>> Kingsley,
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> The point of mirroring the claim in a resource which can be retrieved by de-referencing the URI the holder assigns themselves is so that you can be sure they have a reasonable degree of authority over that URI, and so can use it as an identifier for them.
>>>>> That assurance doesn't come solely from the SAN. It comes from the certificate. The SAN simply offers a slot to hold Name(s). The fact that said Names are de-referencable is a Web scale luxury that most publishers simply cannot afford, as already demonstrated by Peter.
>>> Henry,
>>>> Peter Williams does not prove anything. Peter is not mentioned on the Alice and Bob page.
>>>>   http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alice_and_Bob
>>> I did say he did. I am saying: he's efforts demonstrate the point I am trying to make. I speak about actual implementation examples. Peter is experimenting and showcasing reality.
> 
> Henry,
> 
>> He is experimenting reality?
> 
> Yes, his reality for his use-case scenarios.

Well one does not experiment reality even in that case.

What we would like to know about is his use-cases then. Or rather your use case, as its better if you speak for yourself.

> 
>> As opposed to experimenting with the imaginary worlds?
> 
> There you go again with counter productive subjective commentary.
> 
> Do you know how much it would cost to obtain a modicum of the QA that Peter is providing re. WebID. Ah! I forgot, this all about Open Source and free where individual times costs don't matter, right?

Do you know how much time it takes to read a lot of this? Peter Williams has never implemented WebID at all. So there is very little reason to listen to his always more and more complex ideas. It took him 3 years to even get a working WebId. There are beginner students who have understood how to do it in less time. I have given 2 hour courses where people got to write their foaf file at the end of it, and I think one could do that with hand written webids in less than 3 hours.

All I am saying is that peter williams' inability to do something is interesting but proves very little. (Your argument was that his inability to do something proved something)

> [SNIP]
> The rest of your comments are simply unacceptable. I am not going to be part of threads carrying personal insults (directed at Peter or anyone else).

The rest of the comments I asked you for a use case for what you want to put forward. 

Your arguments seem to be
 - dereferenceable URLs are a luxury
 - There is a fundamental Name/Location problem on the web

Neither of those are convincing to me, as stands.

Then I try to look at what you put forward as a solution, and I try to show that it seems to make an unnecessary triangulation that does not it seems bring much.  I am not the only person having trouble understanding what you are trying to do.

You may be onto something, but it requires more development and clarity of language. So please use well defined vocabulary we understand, that is spec based, so that we don't have to guess what you are going on about all the time.

Perhaps show us:

1. What you put exactly in your cert (written as n3, like I did)
2. What you put in each of the profiles and documents you are referring to
3. what the verification logic is that is being used.
4. what the use case is you are solving. Please describe the actors, their needs, and what they are going to do.

Henry


> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Kingsley Idehen	
> Founder&  CEO
> OpenLink Software
> Company Web: http://www.openlinksw.com
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> 

Social Web Architect
http://bblfish.net/
Received on Monday, 9 January 2012 16:04:35 GMT

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