Re: Offline webapps and speech UI

Ok as long as we agree that the spec will indicate that developers can
generally assume that browsers will accept their requests for specific
recognition/tts resources then we can probably save the details for another
day...

-Andy

> From: Bjorn Bringert <bringert@google.com>
> Date: Wed, 3 Nov 2010 16:19:03 +0100
> To: Satish Sampath <satish@google.com>
> Cc: Andy Mauro <Andy.Mauro@nuance.com>, <Olli@pettay.fi>,
> <public-xg-htmlspeech@w3.org>
> Subject: Re: Offline webapps and speech UI
> 
> I don't know what settings, modes etc browser developers may want to
> introduce in the future, and I agree with Satish that it seems
> somewhat outside the scope of most specs. However, here are some
> examples of browsers ignoring developer wishes when it comes to
> existing features:
> 
> - User style sheets in CSS, e.g. settings to increase font size
> because of eyesight issues or distance to screen or change colors
> because of color vision problems.
> - Private browsing modes that don't store cookies between sessions.
> - Settings to turn off cookies completely.
> - Settings to disables images, JavaScript, animations or audio output.
> - Pop-up and ad blockers.
> - 'Privacy-hardened' browsers that never store cookies etc.
> 
> /Bjorn
> 
> On Wed, Nov 3, 2010 at 4:14 PM, Satish Sampath <satish@google.com> wrote:
>> Listing that would require defining what 'settings', 'modes' and
>> 'specialized browsers' mean. Is there a precedent for this in any
>> other standard or working draft? It also feels like it is quite early
>> to get into such narrow specifics.
>> 
>> Cheers
>> Satish
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Wed, Nov 3, 2010 at 4:09 PM, Andy Mauro <Andy.Mauro@nuance.com> wrote:
>>> It'd be worth enumerating the 'settings, modes or specialized browsers' -
>>> it's not obvious to me why any browser would want to ignore the developers
>>> wishes to use a specialized resource excepting the offline scenario. Unless
>>> we're very clear in specifying the expected default mode of operation and
>>> the specific scenarios under which the defaults are not heeded there is room
>>> for misuse, or more likely, misinterpretation which leads to developer AND
>>> user pain because the quality and functionality of webapps cannot be
>>> controlled.
>>> 
>>> -Andy
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> From: Bjorn Bringert <bringert@google.com>
>>>> Date: Wed, 3 Nov 2010 16:05:47 +0100
>>>> To: Andy Mauro <Andy.Mauro@nuance.com>
>>>> Cc: Satish Sampath <satish@google.com>, <Olli@pettay.fi>,
>>>> <public-xg-htmlspeech@w3.org>
>>>> Subject: Re: Offline webapps and speech UI
>>>> 
>>>> I think we agree that the intention is that typical browsers would by
>>>> default follow the web app's requests. There may be settings, modes or
>>>> specialized browsers that turn it off by default. As long as the
>>>> browser lets the web app know, we won't be any worse off than if the
>>>> browser had simply turned off or never implemented the speech input
>>>> feature.
>>>> 
>>>> /Bjorn
>>>> 
>>>> On Wed, Nov 3, 2010 at 3:54 PM, Andy Mauro <Andy.Mauro@nuance.com> wrote:
>>>>> It really boils down to what the default setting is ;) If it's to reject
>>>>> developer requests for particular reco resources then we're likely not in
>>>>> agreement since IMO this will cause apps to not work if a developer uses
>>>>> recognizer specific functionality (which as much as I don't like this, is
>>>>> the way it is today). If the default is to accept developer requests, and
>>>>> a
>>>>> user has to manually modify the setting to use only local resources or an
>>>>> alternate network resource, then I think all our goals are met (security,
>>>>> privacy, app consistency)
>>>>> 
>>>>> -Andy
>>>>> 
>>>>>> From: Satish Sampath <satish@google.com>
>>>>>> Date: Wed, 3 Nov 2010 15:49:51 +0100
>>>>>> To: Andy Mauro <Andy.Mauro@nuance.com>
>>>>>> Cc: Bjorn Bringert <bringert@google.com>, <Olli@pettay.fi>,
>>>>>> <public-xg-htmlspeech@w3.org>
>>>>>> Subject: Re: Offline webapps and speech UI
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> I'm more concerned with the loophole that arises that seems to mean that
>>>>>>> browsers can simply use their preferred recognizer all the time
>>>>>>> irrespective
>>>>>>> of developer choice.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I don't see that as a loophole, but akin to (2) in your list where the
>>>>>> 'paranoid privacy setting' is 'downloading and using a browser which
>>>>>> uses my preferred recognizer'.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> - Satish
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> --
>>>> Bjorn Bringert
>>>> Google UK Limited, Registered Office: Belgrave House, 76 Buckingham
>>>> Palace Road, London, SW1W 9TQ
>>>> Registered in England Number: 3977902
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Bjorn Bringert
> Google UK Limited, Registered Office: Belgrave House, 76 Buckingham
> Palace Road, London, SW1W 9TQ
> Registered in England Number: 3977902

Received on Wednesday, 3 November 2010 15:25:16 UTC