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Re: Issue 4332: WSDL WG comment 2

From: Fabian Ritzmann <Fabian.Ritzmann@Sun.COM>
Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2007 11:58:29 +0200
To: David Orchard <dorchard@bea.com>
Cc: public-ws-policy@w3.org
Message-id: <45DD6945.2030103@Sun.COM>

I support the removal of identifiers for element declarations and type 
definitions. They don't seem to add any value and introduce unnecessary 
complications.

Fabian


David Orchard wrote:
> There was never agreement to remove them. We agreed that we would 
> provide a document that faithfully captured identifiers for all WSDL 
> 1.1 elements and then scope the policy attachment using wsdl 1.1 EIs 
> to just the subjects defined by ws-policy.
> Cheers,
> Dave
>
>     *From:* Yalcinalp, Umit [mailto:umit.yalcinalp@sap.com]
>     *Sent:* Wednesday, February 21, 2007 3:51 PM
>     *To:* Ashok Malhotra; public-ws-policy@w3.org
>     *Cc:* David Orchard
>     *Subject:* RE: Issue 4332: WSDL WG comment 2
>
>     I have the recollection of agreeing NOT to include element/type
>     decls. Thus, I am somewhat confused as to why we still have them
>     in the document.
>     Shortly, +1 to remove them.
>     --umit
>
>         *From:* public-ws-policy-request@w3.org
>         [mailto:public-ws-policy-request@w3.org] *On Behalf Of *Ashok
>         Malhotra
>         *Sent:* Wednesday, Feb 21, 2007 3:38 PM
>         *To:* public-ws-policy@w3.org
>         *Cc:* dorchard@bea.com
>         *Subject:* RE: Issue 4332: WSDL WG comment 2
>
>         I do not see a usecase for referring to element declarations
>         and type definitions in a WSDL 1.1 document from outside the
>         document.
>
>         So, I’m happy to see them removed.
>
>         DaveO, perhaps you had a reason for including these? If so,
>         pray tell.
>
>         All the best, Ashok
>
>         * From: * public-ws-policy-request@w3.org [mailto:
>         public-ws-policy-request@w3.org ] *On Behalf Of *Paul Cotton
>         *Sent:* Thursday, February 15, 2007 7:09 PM
>         *To:* public-ws-policy@w3.org
>         *Subject:* Issue 4332: WSDL WG comment 2
>
>         http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=4332
>
>         The inclusion of identifiers for element declarations and type
>         definitions (which are not WSDL 1.1 elements) seems
>         inappropriate in this spec. The presence of schema imports and
>         includes makes associating type definitions with a particular
>         WSDL document, and thus with a particular targetNamespace,
>         problematic. These identifiers don’t seem to be required by
>         WS-Policy Attachment. We recommend removing them. If these
>         identifiers remain, a number of issues related to them should
>         be addressed, including:
>
>         a. How imports and includes affect them. Are only in-lined
>         schema elements considered? Only elements in a schema
>         targetNamespace that is the same as the WSDL targetNamespace?
>         If not, which ones?
>
>         b. Clarification in the prose of the spec that WSDL element
>         identifiers identify elements both in the WSDL and Schema
>         namespaces.
>
>         c. Correction of the “types” vs. “type definitions” issue,
>         described at [1].
>
>         [1]
>         http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-ws-desc/2007Feb/0002.html
>
>         Paul Cotton, Microsoft Canada
>         17 Eleanor Drive , Ottawa , Ontario K2E 6A3
>         Tel: (613) 225-5445 Fax: (425) 936-7329
>         mailto:Paul.Cotton@microsoft.com
>
>
>         * From: * public-ws-policy-comments-request@w3.org
>         [mailto:public-ws-policy-comments-request@w3.org] *On Behalf
>         Of *Jonathan Marsh
>         *Sent:* February 15, 2007 9:46 PM
>         *To:* public-ws-policy-comments@w3.org
>         *Cc:* www-ws-desc@w3.org
>         *Subject:* WSDL WG Comments on WSDL 1.1 Element Identifiers
>
>         Follows are some comments from the WSDL WG on the WSDL 1.1
>         Element Identifiers draft.
>
>         1. As in WSDL 2.0 component designators, this spec recommends
>         the creation of an identifier from the targetNamespace of the
>         WSDL 1.1 document, and that this identifier can be resolved
>         without considering imports and includes. Unlike WSDL 2.0, in
>         WSDL 1.1 the targetNamespace is not required, and although
>         there is no wsdl11:include, we have some evidence that some
>         customers have used multiple wsdl11:imports of the same
>         namespace (which can be the same as the targetNamespace) and
>         different locations to modularlize their documents – and that
>         a number of popular tools actually support this “abuse” of
>         import. These situations demonstrate the limits of the
>         assumption of a 1-1 correspondence between a WSDL 1.1 document
>         and a WSDL 1.1 targetNamespace. The spec’s recommendation to
>         construct an identifier using the targetNamespace doesn’t work
>         in these situations. The spec should at least note situations
>         (edge cases) which conflict with the advice about creation of
>         an element identifier from the targetNamespace.
>
>         2. The inclusion of identifiers for element declarations and
>         type definitions (which are not WSDL 1.1 elements) seems
>         inappropriate in this spec. The presence of schema imports and
>         includes makes associating type definitions with a particular
>         WSDL document, and thus with a particular targetNamespace,
>         problematic. These identifiers don’t seem to be required by
>         WS-Policy Attachment. We recommend removing them. If these
>         identifiers remain, a number of issues related to them should
>         be addressed, including:
>
>         d. How imports and includes affect them. Are only in-lined
>         schema elements considered? Only elements in a schema
>         targetNamespace that is the same as the WSDL targetNamespace?
>         If not, which ones?
>
>         e. Clarification in the prose of the spec that WSDL element
>         identifiers identify elements both in the WSDL and Schema
>         namespaces.
>
>         f. Correction of the “types” vs. “type definitions” issue,
>         described at [1].
>
>         Thank you.
>
>         [1]
>         http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-ws-desc/2007Feb/0002.html
>
>         ** Jonathan Marsh ** - http://www.wso2.com -
>         http://auburnmarshes.spaces.live.com
>
Received on Thursday, 22 February 2007 09:58:42 GMT

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