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Re: i008 [was NEW ISSUE: Marking RefProps/RefParams using attributes]

From: Marc Hadley <Marc.Hadley@Sun.COM>
Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 16:04:34 -0500
To: Jonathan Marsh <jmarsh@microsoft.com>
Cc: "Srinivas, Davanum M" <Davanum.Srinivas@ca.com>, public-ws-addressing@w3.org
Message-id: <16C5D15E-4FA6-11D9-B70D-000A95BC8D92@Sun.COM>

On Dec 14, 2004, at 1:37 PM, Jonathan Marsh wrote:
>
> There are the downsides you refer to (schema-validation, signing) but
> those appear to be manageable.  It keeps the generated headers as true
> SOAP headers, participating in the SOAP processing model, including
> targeting the headers via @actor/@role and marking them individually as
> @mustUnderstand.  The wrapping proposals put forward to date lose this
> ability.
>
Interesting point, I'd been assuming that the wrapper based proposals 
included an implicit role/actor='next', relay='true' and the semantic 
to reinsert after processing so that the destination address is always 
available to intermediaries throughout the message path.

Marc.

>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Srinivas, Davanum M [mailto:Davanum.Srinivas@ca.com]
>> Sent: Monday, December 06, 2004 11:17 AM
>> To: Jonathan Marsh; public-ws-addressing@w3.org
>> Subject: RE: NEW ISSUE: Marking RefProps/RefParams using attributes
>>
>> Jonathan,
>>
>> Am lost...which "security problem"?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> dims
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Jonathan Marsh [mailto:jmarsh@microsoft.com]
>> Sent: Monday, December 06, 2004 1:09 PM
>> To: Srinivas, Davanum M; public-ws-addressing@w3.org
>> Subject: RE: NEW ISSUE: Marking RefProps/RefParams using attributes
>>
>> Ok. I guess I'll wait for Glen to explain how such a marker (or the
>> wrapper he prefers) solves the so-called security problem.
>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Srinivas, Davanum M [mailto:Davanum.Srinivas@ca.com]
>>> Sent: Thursday, December 02, 2004 2:07 PM
>>> To: Jonathan Marsh; public-ws-addressing@w3.org
>>> Subject: RE: NEW ISSUE: Marking RefProps/RefParams using attributes
>>>
>>> Jonathan,
>>>
>>> That was a suggestion from Glen. See
>>> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ws-
>>> addressing/2004Nov/0602.ht
>>> ml
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> dims
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Jonathan Marsh [mailto:jmarsh@microsoft.com]
>>> Sent: Thursday, December 02, 2004 3:35 PM
>>> To: Srinivas, Davanum M; public-ws-addressing@w3.org
>>> Subject: RE: NEW ISSUE: Marking RefProps/RefParams using attributes
>>>
>>> What is the purpose of the <wsa:RefPs soap:mustUnderstand="true"/>
>>> header?  Is it really your intention that any SOAP message with
>> refPs
>>> must insert the header with mustUnderstand="true"?
>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: public-ws-addressing-request@w3.org [mailto:public-ws-
>>>> addressing-request@w3.org] On Behalf Of Srinivas, Davanum M
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 2004 10:01 AM
>>>> To: public-ws-addressing@w3.org
>>>> Subject: NEW ISSUE: Marking RefProps/RefParams using attributes
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Title: Marking RefProps/RefParams using attributes
>>>>
>>>> Description: As mentioned in several threads, currently there is
>> no
>>>> way to distinguish between regular soap headers and RefProps and
>>>> RefParams just by looking at the soap message on the wire. One
>> could
>>
>>>> use xml attributes to add extra information on soap headers which
>>> have
>>>
>>>> been added ONLY because they were part of the original EPR. This
>> is
>>>> basically to be in tune with the "Self-description" mantra.
>>>>
>>>> Justification: Different types of intermediaries can use this
>>>> information for various purposes (say caching, monitoring,
>>>> logging/auditing). For example a transparent (does not generate
>>> EPR's
>>>> and is not an endpoint for soap messages) intermediary will be
>> able
>>> to
>>>
>>>> track all Refp's flowing in the system without a user having to
>>> input
>>>> all QName's being used in the system or use some other out of band
>>>> mechanism. Another benefit is that one can even use the same QName
>>> in
>>>> both RefParams and RefProps IF we are able to mark them in some
>>>> fashion and we will be able to apply different policies based on
>>>> whether a QName is being used as a RefParam or present in
>> RefProps.
>>> We
>>>
>>>> also need a way to ensure that attribute is understood by all
>> nodes
>>>> (and more importantly fail when the soap nodes does not know how
>> to
>>>> handle RefParams/RefProps attribute stuff)
>>>>
>>>> Target: Core
>>>>
>>>> Proposal:
>>>> - SOAP Headers that are added because they were part of an EPR's
>>>> ReferenceProperties are marked by adding the following attribute:
>>>> wsa:type="property"
>>>> - SOAP Headers that are added because they were part of an EPR's
>>>> ReferenceParameters are marked by adding the following attribute:
>>>> wsa:type="parameter"
>>>> - If there's at least one soap header marked with the wsa:type
>>>> attribute, then add a new header to ensure that the attribute is
>> not
>>
>>>> ignored silently:
>>>> <wsa:RefPs soap:mustUnderstand="true"/>
>>>>
>>>> Complete Sample:
>>>> <SOAP-ENV:Envelope>
>>>>      <SOAP-ENV:Header>
>>>>          <wsa:ReferenceParameters soap:mustUnderstand="true"/>
>>>>
>>>>          <wsa:ReferenceProperties soap:mustUnderstand="true"/>
>>>>
>>>>          <wsa:MessageID>msgid:1234567902282223</wsa:MessageID>
>>>>
>>> <wsa:To>http://www.example.com/services/someService</wsa:To>
>>>>
>> <wsa:Action>http://www.example.com/someAction</wsa:Action>
>>>>
>>>> <wsa:From>http://www.example.com/clients/someClient</wsa:From>
>>>>
>>>>          ...
>>>>          <tns:resourceID
>>>> wsa:type="property">DataChunk42</tns:resourceID>
>>>>          <tns:expires wsa:type="parameter">32000</tns:expires>
>>>>      </SOAP-ENV:Header>
>>>>      <SOAP-ENV:Body>
>>>>         ...
>>>>      </SOAP-ENV:Body>
>>>> </SOAP-ENV:Envelope>
>>>>
>>>> Problems:
>>>> [1] Possible Schema validation problem mentioned by Glen:
>>>> (http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ws-
>>>> addressing/2004Nov/0602.h
>>>> tml)
>>>> [2] Possible Signing RefProps/RefParams problem mentioned by Rich:
>>>> (http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ws-
>>>> addressing/2004Nov/0592.h
>>>> tml)
>>>>
>>>> Discussion Threads:
>>>> [1]
>>>> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ws-
>>>> addressing/2004Nov/thread.
>>>> html#478
>>>> [2]
>>>> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ws-
>>>> addressing/2004Nov/thread.
>>>> html#544
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Davanum Srinivas
>>>> Computer Associates
>>>> Senior Architect, Web Services Group
>>>> Tel: +1 508 628 8251
>>>> davanum.srinivas@ca.com
>>>> http://ws.apache.org/~dims/
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
---
Marc Hadley <marc.hadley at sun.com>
Web Technologies and Standards, Sun Microsystems.
Received on Thursday, 16 December 2004 21:04:38 GMT

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