Re: WPWG On NOT abandoning the CG specs (was Re: Update on Web Payments Working Group)

Well said indeed Melvin.

p.


On Mon, Sep 26, 2016 at 8:53 PM, Melvin Carvalho <melvincarvalho@gmail.com>
wrote:

>
>
> On 5 April 2016 at 23:05, Manu Sporny <msporny@digitalbazaar.com> wrote:
>
>> On 04/04/2016 06:49 AM, Melvin Carvalho wrote:
>> > Lastly, please please please, dont abandon the CG specifications.
>> > They are some of the best work anywhere.  In a sense the CG is in
>> > some ways ahead of the WG at this point.
>>
>> We have no intention of abandoning the concepts in the CG
>> specifications. We will fight for the consensus positions of this group
>> - level playing field, financial inclusion, innovative ecosystem, etc.
>>
>> The recent scuffle in the Web Payments Working Group is not the end. A
>> decision was made to use the Microsoft/Google specification as the base
>> specification for the Web Payments Browser API. We have the ability to
>> change those specifications. One approach is by submitting
>> counter-specifications like this:
>>
>> https://github.com/w3c/webpayments/pull/115
>>
>> Another approach is for people from this community to pick an issue to
>> fight for/against and move that particular item forward:
>>
>> https://github.com/w3c/browser-payment-api/issues
>
>
> Great!
>
> The way I see it there are three webs, and three payments webs:
>
> Roughly speaking:
>
> The Web 1.0 era (c. 1990-2000) is about web sites.  A typical payments
> solution would be a banking site or paypal.  This is a model that's works
> well on the web and can be standardized in a fairly predictable way by
> identifying common pain points, use case and creating uniform APIs.
> Definitely a pls.
>
> The Web 2.0 era (c. 2000-2010) is more about web pages.  Typically this
> allows a page to be a first class citizen of the web and dynamically access
> the network and update itself.  This has lead to patterns (primarily AJAX)
> that allow remote interaction.  Payments now can be done in the browser
> sandbox within a page, but in a very similar fashion to web 1.0, however
> without page reloads.  Similarly it makes sense for the WG to standardize
> this work and create APIs.
>
> The web 3.0 era (c. 2010-2020+) is about data.  Data, and particularly
> linked data, on the web becomes a first class citizen.  This is a
> fundamentally different model, but also one that very few people have yet
> to understand.  It is in a sense a more distributed and decentralized model
> of the web in line with the original vision.  Payments in this paradigm
> new, exciting, and very powerful, and can solve use cases existing and not
> yet imagined to date.  It can also handle all existing use cases via
> bootstrapping.  In this sense it's very similar to technologies like
> bitcoin.  It also covers a lot of the work done with JSON LD which deals
> with first class data primitives on the web.
>
> While it's valuable to try and modernize the work going on in the WG which
> is really revolved around web 1.0/2.0 technologies imho, it seems there is
> a political will do dumb things down to much that independent web
> developers are struggling to have their use cases addressed.
>
> It's common at the IETF to view a specification and have in your mind what
> future versions of that spec will look like.
>
> So Id like to work on essentially W3C Web Payments NEXT, without waiting
> for the modernization of the vendor payments system, shopping cart
> experience, choosing a credit card, and other nice things the WG is doing,
> but have relatively little relevance to the exciting modern internet
> payments phenomena.  I think the WG has dropped the ball, for various
> reasons on this one, but will possibly still have useful deliverables.
> Let's anticipate that, make it the best it can be, and perhaps look toward
> the next version of payments which can bootstrap the old and create a whole
> new era of use cases on the web ...
>
> I've spent a lot of time doing infrastructure and plumbing work for this.
> Im now ready to actually code stuff on top, and integrate it into real
> world payments workflows and live crypto currencies.
>
> I'd really like to take the recommendations here, and in the block chain
> community group to make very exciting payments workflows, in live systems,
> and incorporate existing useful workflows.
>
>>
>>
>>
>> > I think there is a compelling case to be made though interoperable
>> > implementations.  Im hoping to spend the next 3 quarters of this
>> > year working on some.  This can often be a better way of convincing
>> > people than simply a specification ...
>>
>> Agreed. Implementations matter. Digital Bazaar will be doing an
>> implementation of the Web Payments HTTP API and the hope is that
>> provides a counter-weight to some of the Browser API design decisions.
>>
>> -- manu
>>
>> --
>> Manu Sporny (skype: msporny, twitter: manusporny, G+: +Manu Sporny)
>> Founder/CEO - Digital Bazaar, Inc.
>> blog: The Web Browser API Incubation Anti-Pattern
>> http://manu.sporny.org/2016/browser-api-incubation-antipattern/
>>
>>
>