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Re: Behavior Attachment Redux, was Re: HTML element content models vs. components

From: Ian Hickson <ian@hixie.ch>
Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2011 06:29:06 +0000 (UTC)
To: Dirk Pranke <dpranke@chromium.org>
cc: Dimitri Glazkov <dglazkov@chromium.org>, Roland Steiner <rolandsteiner@chromium.org>, WebApps WG <public-webapps@w3.org>, Dominic Cooney <dominicc@chromium.org>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.64.1110110536260.20981@ps20323.dreamhostps.com>
On Mon, 10 Oct 2011, Dirk Pranke wrote:
> On Wed, Sep 28, 2011 at 4:52 PM, Ian Hickson <ian@hixie.ch> wrote:
> > If an author invents a new element, it doesn't matter what it inherits 
> > from. It won't have fallback behaviour, it won't have semantics that 
> > can be interpreted by search engines and accessibility tools, it won't 
> > have default renderings, and it won't allow for validation to catch 
> > authoring mistakes. I don't see what inheritance has to do with 
> > anything here.
> Ian, apologies if you have answered this before and I haven't seen it, 
> but a (fairly brief) query didn't turn up anything for me: when is it 
> okay to create new elements? Obviously, we created a bunch for HTML 5 
> that don't have fallback behavior ...

Most of the elements that have been added to HTML over the past five years 
actually have a pretty good fallback behaviour. For example, <progress>'s 
contents show in legacy UAs but not new UAs:

   <progress value=45 max=100> 45% complete </progress>

...so there's no loss of semantics or accessibility, it just doesn't look 
as pretty.

> It seems like it would be helpful to distinguish between "new" elements 
> that can be reasonably mapped onto existing elements' semantics and 
> elements that cannot; perhaps we can agree that elements should be 
> reused where possible, but that there should also be mechanism for 
> defining new elements otherwise?

Sometimes <div> or <span> is the most appropriate element, sure. Hopefully 
we can dramatically minimise those cases.

Ian Hickson               U+1047E                )\._.,--....,'``.    fL
http://ln.hixie.ch/       U+263A                /,   _.. \   _\  ;`._ ,.
Things that are impossible just take longer.   `._.-(,_..'--(,_..'`-.;.'
Received on Tuesday, 11 October 2011 06:33:16 UTC

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