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Minutes, March 5th - DOM 3 Events telcon

From: Andrew Emmons <andrew.emmons@quickoffice.com>
Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2008 14:55:23 -0600
To: "public-webapi@w3.org" <public-webapi@w3.org>
Message-ID: <A13D0B44629697468E9C6AE200CFD39A31A64D5B53@mailkeeper.mdigitalm.com>
Hello WG,

Please find below the minutes for today's telcon.

Regards,
Andrew


   [1]W3C

      [1] http://www.w3.org/

                               - DRAFT -

                       Web API WG Teleconference
                              05 Mar 2008

   See also: [2]IRC log

      [2] http://www.w3.org/2008/03/05-webapi-irc

Attendees

   Present
          Carmelo, aemmons, Doug, anne

   Regrets
          Travis

   Chair
          Doug

   Scribe
          aemmons

Contents

     * [3]Topics
         1. [4]merging mousewheel and mousemultiwheel
         2. [5]wheelDelta description
         3. [6]Specific mousewheel tests
     * [7]Summary of Action Items
     _________________________________________________________



   <trackbot> Date: 05 March 2008

   <scribe> Scribe: aemmons

   <scribe> ScribeNick: aemmons

merging mousewheel and mousemultiwheel

   <anne> I looked at the agenda and have nothing to add to the e-mail
   that went to the mailing list.

   <shepazu>
   [8]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webapi/2008Feb/0202.ht
   ml

      [8] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webapi/2008Feb/0202.html

   DS: My investigations seem to indicate that he is wrong
   ... I bought the 'mighty mouse' mouse in question
   ... has a little ball
   ... allows scroll left or right
   ... Made a script that tests mousehweel
   ... It gets events for both dx and dy
   ... Does not distingust between the two
   ... The browser window seems to understand how the mouse ball works

   AvK: You are saying, when you do hoizontal, it receives mousewheel
   and the values chage?

   DS: Yes

   AvK: IE?

   DS: Firefox
   ... Clearly receiving some event
   ... MS seemed to indicate they would rather solve it with one event,
   from last week
   ... I'll make a more complete test across OS and browsers

   AvK: I would like to see the test and results

   AE: I like having a single event what contains the functionality of
   both mousehweel and mousemultiwheel because of content creation
   ... Take for example the Blackberry - older devices have a single y
   wheel, newer ones have multi-wheel
   ... Would be nice to have content written for both without needed to
   listen and register for two events

   AvK: There are use cases having a single event for both
   ... there are use cases for having different events because you can
   do a default action for one direction an something else for another

   <anne> There are use cases for a single event with both vertical and
   horizontal delta as well as uses cases for having separate events so
   you can cancel the default action for either direction.

   <anne> So I guess I'm arguing for having both, though maybe for now
   we should stick to a one if that's infeed feasible, dunno

   DS: IF there are use cases for both, we should pick the most common
   use cases

   AvK: We have a way for doing both
   ... mousemultiwheel does x/y, mousewheel does y

   DS: Unless we have a real-world use case we need to prove there is a
   need not a theoretical use case

   AvK: I am fine having mousewheel with both dx and dy

   DS: If we do this, we could add informative note for cancel
   wrokaround

wheelDelta description

   <shepazu>
   [9]http://www.w3.org/TR/DOM-Level-3-Events/events.html#Events-eventg
   roupings-mousemultiwheelevents

      [9] http://www.w3.org/TR/DOM-Level-3-Events/events.html#Events-eventgroupings-mousemultiwheelevents

   The distance the wheel has rotated around the x-axis.

   <shepazu> "The distance the wheel has rotated around the y-axis."

   A number indicating the distance, measured as the number of "clicks"
   the wheel has been rotated. A positive value indicates that the
   wheel has been rotated away from the user (or in a right-hand manner
   on horizontally aligned devices) and a negative value indicates that
   the wheel has been rotated towards the user (or in a left-hand
   manner on horizontally aligned devices). The default value...

   scribe: of the wheelDelta attribute is 0.

   A "click" is defined to be a unit of rotation. On some devices this
   is a finite physical step. On devices with smooth rotation, a
   "click" becomes the smallest reported amount of rotation.

   [10]http://dev.w3.org/2006/webapi/DOM-Level-3-Events/proposals/mouse
   wheel.txt

     [10] http://dev.w3.org/2006/webapi/DOM-Level-3-Events/proposals/mousewheel.txt

   DS: I'll use this as a base for me proposal

   <scribe> ACTION: Doug to search the SVG archive for wheelDelta
   discussions [recorded in
   [11]http://www.w3.org/2008/03/05-webapi-minutes.html#action01]

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-253 - Search the SVG archive for
   wheelDelta discussions [on Doug Schepers - due 2008-03-12].

   <shepazu>
   [12]http://www.w3.org/TR/2005/WD-SVGMobile12-20051207/svgudom.html

     [12] http://www.w3.org/TR/2005/WD-SVGMobile12-20051207/svgudom.html

   <shepazu> [[ wheelDelta

   <shepazu> Indicates the number of "clicks" the wheel has been
   rotated. A positive value indicates that the wheel has been rotated
   away from the user (or in a right-hand manner on horizontally
   aligned devices) and a negative value indicates that the wheel has
   been rotated towards the user (or in a left-hand manner on
   horizontally aligned devices).

   <shepazu> A "click" is defined to be a unit of rotation. On some
   devices this is a finite physical step. On devices with smooth
   rotation, a "click" becomes the smallest measurable amount of
   rotation.

   <shepazu> ]]

   DS: I do not think we need to be more specific
   ... The user can configure how large the 'clicks' are
   ... If it turns out later that this does not fill common, simple,
   use cases there is nothing stopping us from using the more complex
   model later
   ... for exmaple, a total of 4 events - one for x, y, z and 'uber'
   mousewheel
   ... I can put both proposals to the group
   ... I will put them on the wiki
   ... Tests for wheelDelta
   ... How many, what? How does it relate to scroll?
   ... Regarding testing, need to come up with a systematic way to
   build a testsuite
   ... Script Travis supplied is a good start
   ... We have no place to put the tests that I know of
   ... As of Feb 7, we do not have an offical test suite location

   <scribe> ACTION: Doug to create a test repository [recorded in
   [13]http://www.w3.org/2008/03/05-webapi-minutes.html#action02]

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-254 - Create a test repository [on Doug
   Schepers - due 2008-03-12].

   DS: I'd like to have an eaiser way to manage tests than, for exmaple
   SVG

   (brainstorming better ways)

   <scribe> ACTION: Carmelo to propose a metadata framework for tests
   [recorded in
   [14]http://www.w3.org/2008/03/05-webapi-minutes.html#action03]

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-255 - Propose a metadata framework for
   tests [on Carmelo Montanez - due 2008-03-12].

   <scribe> ACTION: Doug to get feedback from major implementers
   regarding how to best make a test harness that will work for them
   [recorded in
   [15]http://www.w3.org/2008/03/05-webapi-minutes.html#action04]

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-256 - Get feedback from major implementers
   regarding how to best make a test harness that will work for them
   [on Doug Schepers - due 2008-03-12].

Specific mousewheel tests

   DS: Just testing for existence of mousehweel event is step 1

   CM: Yes

   DS: One test to make sure up is +ve
   ... One test to make sure click value is honored
   ... One test that left is +ve
   ... One test for down is -ve
   ... One test for down is -ve
   ... One test for x, y and z
   ... One test to make sure if you have a ball-type wheel if you have
   values for x and y the larger value is wheelDelta

   AE: A currentTarget/target test

   DS: Test for the click units
   ... Some devices give delta in radians
   ... A test to see that the wheelDelta is < 10? I way to test the
   units are in clicks and not radians

   <scribe> ACTION: Talk to RIM to see what their wheel stuff is like
   [recorded in
   [16]http://www.w3.org/2008/03/05-webapi-minutes.html#action05]

   <trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - Talk

   <scribe> ACTION: Doug to talk to RIM to see what their wheel event
   is like [recorded in
   [17]http://www.w3.org/2008/03/05-webapi-minutes.html#action06]

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-257 - Talk to RIM to see what their wheel
   event is like [on Doug Schepers - due 2008-03-12].

   AE: Test for all MouseEvent attributes/methods as well

Summary of Action Items

   [NEW] ACTION: Carmelo to propose a metadata framework for tests
   [recorded in
   [18]http://www.w3.org/2008/03/05-webapi-minutes.html#action03]
   [NEW] ACTION: Doug to create a test repository [recorded in
   [19]http://www.w3.org/2008/03/05-webapi-minutes.html#action02]
   [NEW] ACTION: Doug to get feedback from major implementers regarding
   how to best make a test harness that will work for them [recorded in
   [20]http://www.w3.org/2008/03/05-webapi-minutes.html#action04]
   [NEW] ACTION: Doug to search the SVG archive for wheelDelta
   discussions [recorded in
   [21]http://www.w3.org/2008/03/05-webapi-minutes.html#action01]
   [NEW] ACTION: Doug to talk to RIM to see what their wheel event is
   like [recorded in
   [22]http://www.w3.org/2008/03/05-webapi-minutes.html#action06]
   [NEW] ACTION: Talk to RIM to see what their wheel stuff is like
   [recorded in
   [23]http://www.w3.org/2008/03/05-webapi-minutes.html#action05]

   [End of minutes]
     _________________________________________________________


    Minutes formatted by David Booth's [24]scribe.perl version 1.133
    ([25]CVS log)
    $Date: 2008/03/05 20:50:02 $
     _________________________________________________________

     [24] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm
     [25] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/

Scribe.perl diagnostic output

   [Delete this section before finalizing the minutes.]
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.133  of Date: 2008/01/18 18:48:51
Check for newer version at [26]http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002
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     [26] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/

Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)

Found Scribe: aemmons
Inferring ScribeNick: aemmons
Found ScribeNick: aemmons
Default Present: Carmelo, aemmons, Doug, anne
Present: Carmelo aemmons Doug anne
Regrets: Travis
Found Date: 05 Mar 2008
Guessing minutes URL: [27]http://www.w3.org/2008/03/05-webapi-minutes.h
tml
People with action items: carmelo doug talk

     [27] http://www.w3.org/2008/03/05-webapi-minutes.html

   End of [28]scribe.perl diagnostic output]

     [28] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm


Andrew Emmons
Architect and Manager, SVG Technologies
Co-Chair, W3C SVG Working Group
Quickoffice, BitFlash Division
Web: www.bitflash.com<http://www.bitflash.com/>,
www.quickoffice.com
Received on Thursday, 6 March 2008 03:17:34 GMT

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