W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > public-web-mobile@w3.org > November 2013

[minutes] Nov 27 teleconf

From: Dominique Hazael-Massieux <dom@w3.org>
Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2013 11:36:40 +0100
Message-ID: <1385635000.3574.16.camel@cumulustier>
To: public-web-mobile@w3.org
Hi,

The minutes of our call yesterday are available at:
http://www.w3.org/2013/11/27-webmob-minutes.html

and copied as text below. Please send corrections to the list.

Dom

                            WebMob Teleconf

27 Nov 2013

   [2]Agenda

      [2] http://www.w3.org/mid/CEBA2472.3B270%25nrooney@gsma.com

   See also: [3]IRC log

      [3] http://www.w3.org/2013/11/27-webmob-irc

Attendees

   Present
          marcosc_, Dom, Lisa_DeLuca, schuki, dka,
          +1.919.475.aaaa, stakagi, jo, +1.908.208.aabb,
          Anssi_Kostiainen

   Regrets
   Chair
          Schuki

   Scribe
          dom

Contents

     * [4]Topics
         1. [5]changes to the wiki
         2. [6]Going through task forces
         3. [7]the task forces
         4. [8]How to volunteer and what to do
         5. [9]How to volunteer
         6. [10]Example of Task Forces working
         7. [11]Some cool news from the week
         8. [12]Any Other Business
     * [13]Summary of Action Items
     __________________________________________________________

   <schuki>
   [14]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-web-mobile/2013N
   ov/0017.html

     [14]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-web-mobile/2013Nov/0017.html

   <scribe> ScribeNick: dom

   Schuki: main topic will be task forces
   ... this is a follow up to our F2F meeting in Shenzhen
   ... we went through a lot of the focus areas that have been
   suggested for the group
   ... Marcos and I have been discussing which of the those are
   the most important
   ... the list of task forces is not meant to be definitive; it
   can be amended based on interest
   ... we're happy to have more task forces appear over time
   ... the current list is based on what we've seen as most
   important/timely

changes to the wiki

   <schuki> [15]http://www.w3.org/wiki/Mobile/

     [15] http://www.w3.org/wiki/Mobile/

   Schuki: I've been editing the wiki to reflect this work

   [16]https://twitter.com/w3c_webmob

     [16] https://twitter.com/w3c_webmob

   scribe: As advertised on twitter, I've made changes to our wiki
   ... One of the goals being to make it as easy to use as
   possible
   ... the wiki home page has links to the most important pieces
   [17]http://www.w3.org/wiki/Mobile/

     [17] http://www.w3.org/wiki/Mobile/

   <schuki> [18]http://www.w3.org/wiki/Mobile/Work

     [18] http://www.w3.org/wiki/Mobile/Work

   scribe: I want to raise attention to the "work" page (linked
   from the home page)
   ... it's the results of the conversations in teleconferences,
   at the F2F and more recently with marcos
   ... my suggestion for today was to look at how a task force
   would work before we look at the various proposed task forces

   Marcos: the idea behind a task force is pretty straightforward
   ... a given task force looks at a given problem that has been
   identified
   ... you first want to specify what the problem is
   ... what are existing solutions out there?
   ... who use these solutions, with data gathering
   ... you'll also want to find passionate people
   ... on homescreen bookmarking, I was lucky to have Ernesto help
   out and bring his own set of skills e.g. on data gathering
   ... then we've circulated ideas on twitter, IRC, etc
   ... and from there, it snowballed a bit, with a dedicated IRC
   channel, where new ideas are brought up every day
   ... the key thing is to find people interested with someone in
   charge

   schuki: the general idea is that this is about defining the
   issue, finding a leader, finding interested individuals and
   start building the work
   ... Marcos has been particularly successful in his own task
   force
   ... as we'll hear from his report

   <schuki> [19]http://www.w3.org/wiki/Mobile/Work

     [19] http://www.w3.org/wiki/Mobile/Work

Going through task forces

   Schuki: at the top of the page, there is a table with the list
   of deliverables
   ... (would like to make it as pretty as the GLD group but have
   failed so far)
   ... for each deliverable, the table gives information on status
   and where to find more info
   ... right now, the only one with full information is Marcos'

the task forces

   Schuki: the first TF is particularly relevant in light of our
   discussions at TPAC
   ... The documentation Task force aims to look at the various
   documents we already have (coremob report, webapp state)
   ... there is a lot of duplication and manual work
   ... we would like to automate data gathering as possible
   ... and pull it in a kind of dashboard
   ... rather than having a static document
   ... This would help reduce people's time in building these
   views
   ... and would also make it easier for people to find what
   they're interested in

   <dka> [20]http://www.w3.org/wiki/Mobile/Work

     [20] http://www.w3.org/wiki/Mobile/Work

   Schuki: I expect that task force will have one of the
   co-chairs, as well as Dom
   ... This task force will have "sub-task force"
   ... focusing on "closing the gap" and the "api gap"
   ... work on the document in this space needs to continue in
   parallel to the data gathering/automation
   ... we'll probably want to involve some of the hybrid guys
   (e.G. phonegap)
   ... the other sub-task force is on "web app state"
   ... linked to Dom's quarterly document on state of specs and
   implementations in mobile Web
   ... Dom has started to migrate that work into JSON-based data
   ... but beyond the data stuff, there will still be work in
   tracking status of spec and implementations
   ... the goal will be to migrate this to dashboard style over
   time
   ... One thing we haven't quite specified as a sub task force
   yet, would be the work on use cases / goals
   ... if we do create a task force, I'll let the list know
   ... the next task force is offline
   ... I'll be leading that one
   ... we'll do work in testing and demos on top of ServiceWorker
   ... since serviceworker is set to be the solution in this space
   ... we can help with testing that solution
   ... next task force is around scrolling

   <stakagi> interesting!

   Schuki: scrolling is an often raised issue
   ... but on which we lack detailed information
   ... we need to understand the origins of "janking" and how to
   improve the situation

   <stakagi> I think that this is the issue which should be solved
   also not only to webApps but for declarative contents.

   Schuki: I expect this will be very similar work to what has
   been done on installable webapps
   ... next task force is on installable web apps
   ... I've linked to some of the existing info
   ... Please check out the work that has been done there
   ... next task force is on payments
   ... there is a Web Payments CG that is expected to do lot of
   the related work
   ... they've asked us to build use cases and requirements with a
   mobile focus
   ... a lot of it will be around UI considerations
   ... some of it will relate to operators billings, mobile wallet
   ... The next one is on Permissions
   ... That one is expected to be pretty important
   ... Dom has offered to bring this up with the TAG
   ... this problem affects a number of groups, and beyond mobile
   ... after that, we'll want to build recommendations on how to
   move forward, what model permissions should use
   ... start pay attention to differences
   ... we have put a list of names of people that would be key to
   involve in this
   ... final task force is targeted at "dev tools and diagnostic"
   ... another important one
   ... but on which we also have too little data and info
   ... we really need to find people that can help us get started

   <schuki> [21]http://www.w3.org/wiki/Mobile/Dev_Tools

     [21] http://www.w3.org/wiki/Mobile/Dev_Tools

   Schuki: that ends the list of task forces
   ... We believe we need to focus on few task forces to get
   started
   ... to begin with, we'd like to understand which task forces
   people are keen on focusing on

How to volunteer and what to do

How to volunteer

   <schuki>
   [22]http://www.w3.org/wiki/Mobile/Work#TASK_FORCE:_Homescreen_B
   ookmarking_.2F_Installable_Webapps

     [22]
http://www.w3.org/wiki/Mobile/Work#TASK_FORCE:_Homescreen_Bookmarking_.2F_Installable_Webapps

   Schuki: Each task force has a section for a leader, a list of
   participants, and a set of links
   ... it also defines the primary goal for the task force, and a
   set of tasks
   ... we would like people to volunteer either as leader or
   participants of these various task forces
   ... everyone should have write-access to the wiki; if you
   don't, please contact marcos or me and we'll be happy to edit
   the wiki for you
   ... marcos and I can't lead all of these
   ... we have identified already tasks that a given task force
   can get started with
   ... but this shouldn't be seen as prescriptive, more as a
   source of inspiration
   ... we would like task forces to manage themselves on the
   mailing list
   ... or via whichever tool is best adapted to your group
   (tracker, github issues, etc)
   ... allowing everyone to move forward quickly
   ... I'll edit the page to clarify this approach
   ... any question?
   ... questions are always welcome afterwards on IRC or by email

Example of Task Forces working

   Schuki: marcos has been doing some excellent work in homescreen
   task force
   ... I'm monitoring the related repo and have been flooded with
   all the work
   ... Marcos, any lessons from that success?

   Marcos: as I've pointed out, the key is really to find people
   interested in the problem
   ... the data we had gathered also proved to be timely useful

   <anssik> ppl interested in this topic should join #manifest

   Marcos: you need to ask questions, and research what needs to
   be understood
   ... we can also help find people that can help or who can help
   find people that can help
   ... e.g. for scrolling

   Schuki: any random Paul @ Google is probably a good target
   ... if you need to find contacts, please let marcos and I know

Some cool news from the week

   Schuki: there was a Chrome summit last week
   ... a lot of great work and good talks on a number of topics

   <schuki> [23]http://mobile-ux.appspot.com/#1

     [23] http://mobile-ux.appspot.com/#1

   Schuki: some of the relevant points came from Paul Kinlan's
   talk

   <schuki> [24]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jiXVpj3QKZQ

     [24] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jiXVpj3QKZQ

   Schuki: I haven't found the youtube for the actual talk
   ... any highlight you want to give, Marcos?
   ... lot of work around rendering, screen sizes, etc

   Marcos: lots of stuff around perf of Web apps on mobile
   ... in particular, in terms of UX (what's missing, what could
   be improved)
   ... with comparison with e.g. Android
   ... they seem to have done a lot of the research we were
   planning to do
   ... they provide a great perf analysis tool too
   ... Talk starts around 1:18:00 in the day-long video record

   <schuki>
   [25]http://ben-evans.com/benedictevans/2013/11/5/mobile-is-eati
   ng-the-world-autumn-2013-edition

     [25]
http://ben-evans.com/benedictevans/2013/11/5/mobile-is-eating-the-world-autumn-2013-edition

   schuki: please share news on the list, esp. for stuff relevant
   to our task forces

Any Other Business

   DKA: for those that weren't at TPAC, it may be worth mentioning
   that the Tizen/FFOS interop demo we did
   ... I'll summarize on the list

   <schuki> [26]http://www.w3.org/wiki/Mobile/Work

     [26] http://www.w3.org/wiki/Mobile/Work

   Schuki: please everyone, look at the "Work" page
   ... look at the task forces, and anything you feel as important
   to you
   ... put your name on it
   ... we won't start it all before christmas, we'll probably
   start with the one that have the most momentum
   ... but if you have interest, expertise on a topic, put your
   name in
   ... I'm calling for volunteers on the offline task force
   ... esp. looking for people interested in building demos on top
   of the first implementations
   ... As a reminder, if we don't have volunteers to do the work,
   the work simply won't happen
   ... We'll have our next call two weeks from now

   <dka> +1 to making it more friendly to asian companies

   Schuki: the time isn't great for Asian participants though
   ... how people would feel to alternate between GMT-morning and
   GMT-afternoon

   DKA: I support the proposal, but in that case, let's plan the
   times well in advance and publish an icalendar feed

   <schuki> [27]http://www.w3.org/wiki/Mobile/Meetings

     [27] http://www.w3.org/wiki/Mobile/Meetings

   DKA: (even the call this morning escaped my notice)
   ... in the TAG, we're using ical to advertise our meetings and
   it has proved extremely useful

   <schuki> action natasha to setup ical feed

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-101 - Setup ical feed [on Natasha
   Rooney - due 2013-12-04].

   DKA: you still send reminders, but it makes much easier for
   participants, esp. with changing times

   schuki: if anyone feels bad about that proposal, please contact
   me
   ... but otherwise, we'll proceed with alternating between
   3pmUTC and 8amUTC
   ... we'll post the minutes to the list
   ... AND DON'T FORGET TO ADD YOURSELF TO THE TASK FORCES
   ... or I'll find you two weeks from now
   ... and you'll be sorry

   <stakagi> bye

Summary of Action Items

   [End of minutes]
Received on Thursday, 28 November 2013 10:36:55 UTC

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