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Re: Don't disclose election results

From: Jean-Charles (JC) Verdié <jicheu@yahoo.fr>
Date: Wed, 04 Jun 2014 11:24:45 +0200
Message-ID: <538EE5DD.40806@yahoo.fr>
To: "Bassetti, Ann" <ann.bassetti@boeing.com>
CC: Karl Dubost <karl@la-grange.net>, Brian Kardell <bkardell@gmail.com>, Robin Berjon <robin@berjon.com>, "public-w3process@w3.org" <public-w3process@w3.org>
(omnibus reply)

* I acknowledge there are cultural differences which make it tricky to
publish results given it was not stated before the election began. But
this is an assumption. That'd be great if someone neutral (within the
team?) contacted each candidate in person to get their actual feeling
about it.

* I'm not sure these cultural differences still make sense when it comes
to anonymised results. If we read that candidate "A" got 3 ballots and
candidate "B" got 98, that's probably fine with respect to the future
life of candidate "JC" or "Virginie", given that it's not so easy (out
of 12 people) to identify who is A and who is B.

* We're not a democracy nor a country FWIW. We belong to a consortium
and our companies pay an insane amount of money to get there. I'd like
to understand how such an amount of money do not bring people to believe
it's important to contribute, at least when it comes to voting (for
AB/TAG but also for chartering).

* Same thing on different angle, I was not aware of such a poor
engagement. Probably some more work needs to be done here. AB?
Elsewhere? I'll be happy to help.

* As Daniel stated for himself regarding last year's ballot, I'd really
like to know my own results. It's important for me to know if I needed
two other ballots to get elected or if I had 0 casts. That would
determine my future willingness to run again or not BTW. If this is
really humiliating then may be the W3C can communicate this information
privately to candidates.

* I don't mix transparency with trust. I trust the W3C not to tamper
with the results (but I trusted a lot of companies not to tamper with my
data until some revelations happened last year so...). but trusting the
W3C does not mean I do not want to understand what's going on. The
results of the last 2 AB ballots bring a lot of  information about the
direction the AC Reps want the consortium to take, detailed results
would probably bring a lot of additional valuable data.


Regards
JC


Bassetti, Ann wrote:
> As you can imagine, I appreciate Robin and Karl articulating the kinds of points I was trying to make.
> 
> I also appreciate Brian's efforts (as well as others'). It is primarily this cultural context I am worried about, when it's hard for us to relate to another culture. Or sometimes to even be aware that such a difference exists!
> 
> Ann Bassetti
> From: Karl Dubost
> Sent: Tuesday, June 3, 2014 1:18 PM
> To: Brian Kardell
> Cc: Robin Berjon; public-w3process@w3.org
> Subject: Re: Don't disclose election results (was: Disclosing election results -- a voice of caution)
> 
> 
> Brian,
> 
> Le 4 juin 2014 à 02:46, Brian Kardell <bkardell@gmail.com> a écrit :
>> Also, class president in school - and yet people continue to live their life despite the fact that high school is highly emotional and popularity is considered important to a lot of people who would run.
> 
> non sequitur. As it is something, we can't really assess. There are plenty of ways we could make a different argument. Some kids commit suicide or the stakes are very different, etc.
> 
> 
>> It feels to me (but I am willing to admit that this might not be the majority position if it turns out that way) like we are all adults here and doing the best that we can - there are any number of reasons you can lose an election - for example: People just don't know you, so they don't trust you as much as someone they do know.
> 
> culture. You are talking from a cultural point of view where failures are accepted (even valued in some cases) and where being outspoken is a quality. So you are trying to solve an issue which is consistent with your cultural background. Some adults do not have the same constraints. Would you think, for example, that in case of a failure on a business project, the suicide is seen by the community as an honorable end? And still it is happening in some environments.
> 
> I agree with Robin here. People often mix up transparency with trust. Usually we use higher transparency for solving a trust issue. Total transparency doesn't solve an issue by itself, it even creates a lot of them too. What we need is reliable social mechanisms of trust and adjust it when necessary.
> 
> 
>> Frankly, and this is simply my own opinion, if my employer would really punish me for losing an election for AB, I think I'd be looking for another job because it is a terribly illogical thing to do.
> 
> Consider yourself as privileged. That's a good thing that you have this freedom. Don't put the weight of your freedom on the shoulders of others.
> 
> 
> --
> Karl Dubost 🐄
> http://www.la-grange.net/karl/
> 
> 
Received on Wednesday, 4 June 2014 09:25:16 UTC

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