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RE: New Proposal - Measurement (in support of describing sports statistics)

From: Jason Johnson (BING) <jasjoh@microsoft.com>
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2014 23:20:52 +0000
To: "trond.huso@ntb.no" <trond.huso@ntb.no>, "public-vocabs@w3.org" <public-vocabs@w3.org>
Message-ID: <6547d6fc9b324ebea46cb466820965d6@DM2PR0301MB0911.namprd03.prod.outlook.com>
Hi Trond,

Thanks for pointing that out - I have already made updates to a draft version that establishes more consistency in usage of examples throughout the document.

Re: your examples, the soccer example is correct, but it looks like we're not aligned on what consists of 'duration' vs 'quantity' in the x-games example.  See my updated version below and notes explaining my reasoning.  Let me know if that clears it up.

"'Jamie did a 20 feet air at the X Games Huston in 2014 in the Highest air competition, in the first run..."

'Jamie' - the subject (object) of the measurement
'2014 Houston X-Games, Run 1' - the duration of the measurement **
'20 feet' - the quantity that was measured
'20' - the numerical value in the quantity
'feet' - the unit of measurement in the quantity

** This is a bit confusing due to the complexity of modeling event series and super/sub events.   Extrapolating on your example, let's further assume that :

a.  It was during the first run of the 'Men's Super-Bike Freestyle Event' in which Jamie achieved 20 feet of air.
b. The Men's Super-Bike Freestyle Event is composed of three (3) runs, scored independently
c.  The Men's Super-Bike Freestyle Event is one of many other events that take place during the 2014 X-Games Competition in Houston, TX

What we have is three distinct yet related Event instances.  It is the first event (a) - the first run - which defines the duration of the measurement.

Does that clear things up?



-----Original Message-----
From: trond.huso@ntb.no [mailto:trond.huso@ntb.no] 
Sent: Thursday, September 4, 2014 2:50 AM
To: public-vocabs@w3.org
Subject: RE: New Proposal - Measurement (in support of describing sports statistics)

Dear Jason,

Great work. And a valuable contribution. 
Looks good. Just one suggestion:
In the document you are using the imaginable player John, but in the examples below there are no references to this example. I am suggesting you add how you use schema.org to mark up / design what you have defined in the example.
Again: Just a suggestion, not a demand.

The information I am referring to is on page 1 and at the top of page 2.

Just to test your example with another sport:
I want to describe that 'Jamie did a 20 feet air at the X Games Huston in 2014 in the Highest air competition, in the first run..."
Jamie - Subject of the measurement
X Games Huston 2014, highest air competition - is the duration
1 run - the quantity that was measured
20 - is the number in that quantity
Feet -is the unit in that quantity

Also testing with soccer:
Description to be tested: 'John has received two yellow cards during the Norwegian Elite series'
John - Subject of the measurement
Norwegian Elite series - the duration
2 Yellow cards - is the quantity that was measured
2 - is the number in that quantity
Yellow cards - is the unit in that quantity...

Are both these examples correct, or did I miss something?

(I have not marked this up with JSON as I have not done any real schema.org markup like that (not completed schema.org-for-dummies-class.... ;) ))

Trond


All,

I have published a new draft (1.1) of this proposal that incorporates updates based on community feedback thus far.  Please take a look and let me know how you like the updates.

Cheers,

- Jason

-----Original Message-----
From: Jason Johnson (BING) [mailto:jasjoh@microsoft.com]
Sent: Friday, August 29, 2014 10:43 AM
To: Mike Bergman; Simon.Cox@csiro.au; public-vocabs@w3.org
Subject: RE: New Proposal - Measurement (in support of describing sports statistics)

+1

Thank you for sharing Simon :)

-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Bergman [mailto:mike@mkbergman.com]
Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2014 4:56 PM
To: Simon.Cox@csiro.au; Jason Johnson (BING); public-vocabs@w3.org
Subject: Re: New Proposal - Measurement (in support of describing sports statistics)

Hi Simon,

Thank you; these two references are super.

Mike

On 8/28/2014 6:38 PM, Simon.Cox@csiro.au wrote:
> If you are dabbling in this area, possibly worth aligning terminology 
> with VIM [1], and standards In the technical community such as ISO
> 19156 O&M (summarized at [2] and links). ‘Measurement’ is generally 
> understood as a special case of ‘observation’, being a value 
> estimation event whose result is a scaled number (i.e. a ‘quantity’).
>
> [1] http://www.bipm.org/en/publications/guides/vim.html

>
> [2] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Observations_and_Measurements

>
> *From:*Jason Johnson (BING) [mailto:jasjoh@microsoft.com]
> *Sent:* Thursday, 28 August 2014 4:08 AM
> *To:* public-vocabs@w3.org
> *Subject:* New Proposal - Measurement (in support of describing sports
> statistics)
>
> In order to support describing sports statistics, we need the ability 
> to describe measurements that happen over a certain time period, where 
> the value of the measurement can either be a quantity or a rate.  Our 
> current schema.org vocabulary is not sufficient to cover these needs 
> but models, somewhat inconsistently, various aspects of it.  This 
> proposal aims to clean up the existing vocabulary a bit and introduce 
> new terminology to meet the needs of describing sports statistics.
>
> Impacted classes and properties include:
>
> http://schema.org/StructuredValue

>
> http://schema.org/QuantativeValue

>
> http://schema.org/value

>
> http://schema.org/unitCode

>
> The Sports proposal is dependent upon review and approval of this 
> proposal or similar alternative.  The ItemList proposal also takes 
> advantage of this proposal.
>
> https://www.w3.org/wiki/WebSchemas/Measurement

>
> https://www.w3.org/wiki/File:Schema.orgMeasurement.pdf

>
> I look forward to your timeline feedback.
>
> Cheers,
>
> *Jason Johnson*
>
> Microsoft | Bing
>

Received on Thursday, 4 September 2014 23:21:21 UTC

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