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Minutes of TT WG Teleconference on 10/09/03

From: Thierry MICHEL <tmichel@w3.org>
Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2004 17:38:26 +0100
To: <public-tt@w3.org>
Message-ID: <003101c3d6cf$021c4f90$0200a8c0@wistiti>



Minutes of TT WG Teleconference on 10/09/03

Attendees

  Glenn Adams (XFSI, Chair, Scribe) [GA]
  Sean Hayes (Microsoft) [SH]
  David Kirby (BBC) [DK]
  Dave Singer (Apple) [DS]
  Erik Hodge (RealNetworks) [EH]
  Geoff Freed (WGBH/NCAM) [GF1]
  Thierry Michel (W3C) [TM]

Regrets

  Markus Gylling (Daisy) [MG]
  Mike Dolan (Invited Expert) [MD]

Absent

  Gerry Field (WGBH/NCAM) [GF2]
  Markku Hakkinen (JSRPD) [MH]
  George Kerscher (Daisy) [GK]
  Brad Botkin (WGBH/NCAM) [BB]

************************************************************************
Agenda
************************************************************************

1. Review Open Action Items
2. Review Open Issues
3. Continuation of agenda from F2F
   * Brainstorm Timing and Animation Requirements Solutions
   * Brainstorm Metadata Requirements Solutions
   * Plan Minimum Profiles
4. Discuss exit criteria determination

************************************************************************
1. Review Open Actions
************************************************************************

Action: [GA] To send notice to SMPTE, WAI, I18N, SYMM, SVG requesting
final comments on TT-AF-1-0-REQ by Nov 1.

Open.

Action: [DS] To send notice to MPEG, IETF, and 3GPP requesting
final comments on TT-AF-1-0-REQ by Nov 1.

Waiting for GA.

Action: [MG] To send notice to Daisy requesting final comments on
TT-AF-1-0-REQ by Nov 1.

GA needs to tell MG about this action item.

Action: [GF] Verify behavior of backspace commands with pop-on mode.

Done. It is applicable (actually not visible) in pop-on, since it would
on offscreen buffer prior to pop-on.

Action: [BB] To determine semantics of form-feed (FF) and report back.
To also check on HCR (0x0E) semantics.

GF will follow with BB.

Action: [GA] Request XML Schema WG revise definition of xs:Language to
use RFC3066.

Open.

Action: [SH] Will investigate use of media queries in this context and
report back.

Open.

Action: [DS with help of Paul Nelson and Peter Lofting] Write RFC to
register appropriate opentype/truetype font types as MIME media types,
suggest model of "application/font-<font-type-name>", e.g.,
"application/font-truetype".

Has verified that they are not registered. Will continue working on
registering.

Action: [GA] Discuss with XSL WG as required to resolve.

Open. [Need to clarify this action item.]

************************************************************************
2. Review Open Issues
************************************************************************

Issue: Whether to use XLink vocabulary, e.g., as used consistently by
SVG, or use "src" attribute as apparently will be done in XHTML2?

Remains open; assign task to investigate and report back to GA.

Issue: Whether to use IRIs instead of URIs? Note: XPointer and
Namespaces in 1.1 use IRIs?

Remains open; assign task to investigate and report back to GF.

Issue: Should we use "class" instead of "role"?

Remains open; assign task to investigate and report back to SH.
GA will find examples of use of "role" that may help us resolve this
issue.

Issue: Need to define what semantics if &#x000A; does come through (as
well as other NLF sequences).

Resolution: treat as normalizable without hard line break semantics,
use <br/> and <character code="000A"/> for all hard line breaks.

[DS] Agrees this can be default going forward.

Issue: If we need hierarchical definition of regions, e.g., due to
nested regions, then we should express this hierarchy separately from
flows hierarchy and reference regions from flows. Otherwise, if we have
a flat region model, i.e., regions all defined relative to origin of
display medium, then it would suffice to incorporate region definition
as style properties on each flow. We need to determine which of these
to support?

Remains open; assign task to investigate and report back to GF with
help from EH.

Issue: Whether to define the region and viewport vocabulary in content
section or in style vocab section?

Resolution: use style vocab section as a tentative placeholder.

Issue: Probably want to permit in logical content mode the selection of
content based on generic XML features of non-TT namespace descriptive
markup, e.g., for applying style and timing semantics, in which case an
appropriate TT container element shall be implied based on nearest
ancestor TT namespace element.

Remains open; assign task to investigate and report back to GA.

Issue: Need to think about cascading semantics; how to express, how to
apply, etc. Possibly use CSS semantics here as well.

[GA] Need to think about whether to support cascading semantics only
in logical flowed content usage or also in presentational flowed content
usage. Probably only in logical flowed content but need investigate.

Remains open; assign task to investigate and report back to GA will
help from GF.

Issue: for origin property, it appears to be somewhat unnatural to have
to express in terms of absolute left, right, top, bottom such that this
is portable for different writing modes; the intuitive definition is
that origin(10px,10px) is 10px down and right from container in LR-TB
writing modes, but that this is 10px down and left from container's top
right vertex in RL-TB writing modes, etc.  In other words, is the
vertex for the reference point of the containing area and the vertex
for the reference point of the contained area always the TOP,LEFT
vertex or does this depend on the writing mode, e.g., TOP,RIGHT for
RL-TB and TOP,RIGHT for TB-RL?

Remains open; assign task to investigate and report back to GA.
See action item about talking to XSL WG.

************************************************************************
3. Developing Exit Criteria
************************************************************************

See Process Document [1] Section 7.4.4 item #2. We need to define what
"implementing a feature" means and what "interoperable implementation
of a feature" means in the context of an authoring format.

[1] http://www.w3.org/Consortium/Process/

************************************************************************
4. Planning Minimum Profile(s)
************************************************************************

[EH] Would like us to think about real world use of TT-AF. Wants us to
focus on minimum profile requirements.

[GA] Describes initial schema draft and examples.

[GA] Describes 2-prong vs 3-prong profiling: (1) basic and advanced or
(2) basic, full, advanced.

Action: [EH] and [GF] provide input on features they think are out
of scope for basic profile.

[DS] Reiterates mantra "simple should be simple, complex should be
possible".

[GA] Trys to hold this dictum; also "pay only for what you need", i.e.,
"cost of what you need shouldn't mandate significant extra cost for
things you don't need".

************************************************************************
5. Continuation of agenda from F2F
************************************************************************

   * Brainstorm Timing and Animation Requirements Solutions
   * Brainstorm Metadata Requirements Solutions

No time for discussion.

************************************************************************
Next Meeting
************************************************************************

[GA] No telecon for 10/16.

10/23/03 - Telecon
10/30/03 - Telecon

************************************************************************
ADJOURNS at 1220h Eastern Time (US)
************************************************************************

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START SUMMARY
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++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

*** RESOLUTIONS ***

Resolution: treat as normalizable without hard line break semantics,
use <br/> and <character code="000A"/> for all hard line breaks.

Resolution: use style vocab section as a tentative placeholder for
region/viewport elements.

*** OPEN ACTION ITEMS ***

Action: [GA] To send notice to SMPTE, WAI, I18N, SYMM, SVG requesting
final comments on TT-AF-1-0-REQ by Nov 1.

Action: [DS] To send notice to MPEG, IETF, and 3GPP requesting
final comments on TT-AF-1-0-REQ by Nov 1.

Action: [MG] To send notice to Daisy requesting final comments on
TT-AF-1-0-REQ by Nov 1.

Action: [BB] To determine semantics of form-feed (FF) and report back.
To also check on HCR (0x0E) semantics.

Action: [GA] Request XML Schema WG revise definition of xs:Language to
use RFC3066.

Action: [SH] Will investigate use of media queries in this context and
report back.

Action: [DS with help of Paul Nelson and Peter Lofting] Write RFC to
register appropriate opentype/truetype font types as MIME media types,
suggest model of "application/font-<font-type-name>", e.g.,
"application/font-truetype".

Action: [GA] Discuss with XSL WG as required to resolve.

Action: [EH] and [GF] provide input on features they think are out
of scope for basic profile.

Action: [GA] Make proposal regarding use of Xlink vocabulary or
"src" attribute.

Action: [GF] Investigate whether to use IRIs instead of URIs?
Note: XPointer and Namespaces in 1.1 use IRIs?

Action: [SH] Investigate use of "role" vs "class" attribute.

Action: [GF] and [EH] Investigate need for hierachical region
definitions.

Action: [GA] Investigate selection of non-TT vocabulary for
application of style/timing semantics.

Action: [GA] and [GF] Investigate mechanism for cascading
semantics and whether to support cascading on either or both
logical and presentation flowed vocabularies.

Action: [GA] Investigate writing system relative use of
origin style parameter.

*** OPEN ISSUES ***

Issue: Whether to use XLink vocabulary, e.g., as used consistently by
SVG, or use "src" attribute as apparently will be done in XHTML2?

Issue: Whether to use IRIs instead of URIs? Note: XPointer and
Namespaces in 1.1 use IRIs?

Issue: Should we use "class" instead of "role"?

Issue: If we need hierarchical definition of regions, e.g., due to
nested regions, then we should express this hierarchy separately from
flows hierarchy and reference regions from flows. Otherwise, if we have
a flat region model, i.e., regions all defined relative to origin of
display medium, then it would suffice to incorporate region definition
as style properties on each flow. We need to determine which of these
to support?

Issue: Probably want to permit in logical content mode the selection of
content based on generic XML features of non-TT namespace descriptive
markup, e.g., for applying style and timing semantics, in which case an
appropriate TT container element shall be implied based on nearest
ancestor TT namespace element.

Issue: Need to think about cascading semantics; how to express, how to
apply, etc. Possibly use CSS semantics here as well.

Issue: for origin property, it appears to be somewhat unnatural to have
to express in terms of absolute left, right, top, bottom such that this
is portable for different writing modes; the intuitive definition is
that origin(10px,10px) is 10px down and right from container in LR-TB
writing modes, but that this is 10px down and left from container's top
right vertex in RL-TB writing modes, etc.  In other words, is the
vertex for the reference point of the containing area and the vertex
for the reference point of the contained area always the TOP,LEFT
vertex or does this depend on the writing mode, e.g., TOP,RIGHT for
RL-TB and TOP,RIGHT for TB-RL?

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END SUMMARY
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Received on Friday, 9 January 2004 11:38:35 UTC

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