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Meeting record: 2008-05-20 SWD telecon

From: Reul, Q. H. <q.reul@abdn.ac.uk>
Date: Wed, 21 May 2008 09:30:43 +0100
Message-ID: <2AD2401FC36E784094D0B3375FDA6CE803B4F44F@VMAIL2.uoa.abdn.ac.uk>
To: "W3C SWD WG" <public-swd-wg@w3.org>

The [1] record of yesterday's SemWeb Deployment WG telecon is ready for
review. A text copy follows below.

[1] http://www.w3.org/2008/05/20-swd-minutes

Topics
   1. Admin
   2. SKOS
   3. RDFa
   4. Recipe
   5. Vocabulary Management

Summary of Resolutions
   RESOLUTION: Accept minute from Washington f-2-f
   RESOLUTION: Accept last week minute

Summary of Action Items
*[NEW]* *ACTION:* Margherita to liase with author primer about example
using plain literals and some with datatype literals [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/20-swd-minutes.html#action17]

*[PENDING]* *ACTION:* Sean and Alistair to send a file for the namespace
[recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/05/06-swd-minutes.html#action04]
*[PENDING]* *ACTION:* Guus and Alistair write text for Reference
indicating understanding of a possible need for future patterns for
n-Ary label relations [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/06-swd-minutes.html#action08]
*[PENDING]* *ACTION:* Clay will respond to Jakob about the resolution
for notations and x-notation [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/07-swd-minutes.html#action01]
*[PENDING]* *ACTION:* alistair and sean to add a note about
irreflexivity to Reference [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/06-swd-minutes.html#action05]
*[PENDING]* *ACTION:* Alistair to check the old namespace wrt
dereferencing [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/06-swd-minutes.html#action03]
*[PENDING]* *ACTION:* Antoine and Ed to add content to Primer about
irreflexivity [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/06-swd-minutes.html#action06]
*[PENDING]* *ACTION:* Ben to prepare draft implementation report for
RDFa (with assistance from Michael) [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/01/22-swd-minutes.html#action14]
*[PENDING]* *ACTION:* Ed to investigate what text could be added to
primer re. concept co-ordination [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/04/22-swd-minutes.html#action02]
*[PENDING]* *ACTION:* Ed to review the new Editor's Draft of the Recipes
[recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/05/13-swd-minutes.html#action05]
*[PENDING]* *ACTION:* Editors of the Use Cases to clean up the lists of
requirements in light of resolutions [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/07-swd-minutes.html#action02]
*[PENDING]* *ACTION:* Guus to mail his position on issues 72, 73 and 75
to the list [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/13-swd-minutes.html#action25]
*[PENDING]* *ACTION:* Guus to write primer text re: broaderGeneric and
equivalence w/r/t subclass [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/03/18-swd-minutes.html#action08]
*[PENDING]* *ACTION:* Ralph compose intermediate pages for
http://www.w3.org/TR/swbp-skos-core-spec and
http://www.w3.org/TR/swbp-skos-core-guide/ to inform readers of the
paths to the old and new SKOS documents [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/06-swd-minutes.html#action02]
*[PENDING]* *ACTION:* Ralph propose resolution to ISSUE-16 "Default
behavior" [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2007/01/22-swd-minutes.html#action14]
*[PENDING]* *ACTION:* Ralph to review the new Editor's Draft of the
Recipes [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/13-swd-minutes.html#action06]
*[PENDING]* *ACTION:* Ralph/Diego to work on Wordnet implementation [of
Recipes implementations] [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/01/22-swd-minutes.html#action20]
*[PENDING]* *ACTION:* Sean to write a proposal to indicate to OWL WG our
requirements for annotation properties [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/06-swd-minutes.html#action07]

 *[DROPPED]* *ACTION:* Ralph to check whether the common interpretation
of rdfs isDefinedBy fits thereasoning that was made in
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2007Oct/0141.html
<http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2007Oct/0141.html>
[recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/18-swd-minutes.html#action10]
[recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/05/20-swd-minutes.html#action03]

 
*[DONE]* *ACTION:* Alistair to close issue 64 [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/13-swd-minutes.html#action26]
*[DONE]* *ACTION:* Guus and Sean propose some owl:imports text for
Primer [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/06-swd-minutes.html#action01]
*[DONE]* *ACTION:* Jon and Diego to publish a new Editor's Draft of the
Recipes [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/13-swd-minutes.html#action04]
*[DONE]* *ACTION:* Jon will correct the PURL references in the recipes
and update the files in W3space [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/04/29-swd-minutes.html#action12]
*[DONE]* *ACTION:* Margherita to send an email on the need to keep
symbolic labels [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/13-swd-minutes.html#action24]


The full text of the minutes follows.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

<scribe> *ACTION:* Ed to investigate what text could be added to primer
re. concept co-ordination [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/04/22-swd-minutes.html#action02] *[CONTINUES]*

<scribe> *ACTION:* Guus to write primer text re: broaderGeneric and
equivalence w/r/t subclass [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/03/18-swd-minutes.html#action08] *[CONTINUES]*

<scribe> *ACTION:* Ralph to check whether the common interpretation of
rdfs isDefinedBy fits thereasoning that was made in
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2007Oct/0141.html
<http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2007Oct/0141.html>
[recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/18-swd-minutes.html#action10]
*[DROPPED]* [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/20-swd-minutes.html#action03]

<Antoine> believe the action has been dropped

<seanb> action droped @ bottom of
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/13-swd-irc#T15-38-04

<aliman> SKOS primer doesn't mention the property
... but Ralph was keen to have the property
... Ralph to make suggestion if required
... but believe that Ralph doesn't have a problem

<seanb> requested for confirmation between use of property in schema vs
vocabulary

<scribe> *ACTION:* alistair and sean to add a note about irreflexivity
to Reference [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/06-swd-minutes.html#action05] *[CONTINUES]*

<scribe> *ACTION:* Alistair to check the old namespace wrt dereferencing
[recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/05/06-swd-minutes.html#action03]
*[CONTINUES]*

<scribe> *ACTION:* Antoine and Ed to add content to Primer about
irreflexivity [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/06-swd-minutes.html#action06] *[CONTINUES]*

<scribe> *ACTION:* Guus and Alistair write text for Reference indicating
understanding of a possible need for future patterns for n-Ary label
relations [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/06-swd-minutes.html#action08] *[CONTINUES]*

<scribe> *ACTION:* Guus and Sean propose some owl:imports text for
Primer [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/06-swd-minutes.html#action01] *[DONE]*

<seanb>
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2008May/0037.html

<scribe> *ACTION:* Ralph compose intermediate pages for
http://www.w3.org/TR/swbp-skos-core-spec and
http://www.w3.org/TR/swbp-skos-core-guide/ to inform readers of the
paths to the old and new SKOS documents [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/06-swd-minutes.html#action02] *[CONTINUES]*

<scribe> *ACTION:* Sean and Alistair to send a file for the namespace
[recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/06-swd-minutes.html#action04] *[CONTINUES]*

<scribe> *ACTION:* Sean to write a proposal to indicate to OWL WG our
requirements for annotation properties [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/06-swd-minutes.html#action07] *[CONTINUES]*

<scribe> *ACTION:* Clay will respond to Jakob about the resolution for
notations and x-notation [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/07-swd-minutes.html#action01] *[CONTINUES]*

<scribe> *ACTION:* Editors of the Use Cases to clean up the lists of
requirements in light of resolutions [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/07-swd-minutes.html#action02] *[CONTINUES]*

<scribe> *ACTION:* Alistair to close issue 64 [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/13-swd-minutes.html#action26] *[DONE]*

see http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/track/issues/64

<Antoine> http://www.w3.org/2008/05/13-swd-minutes.html#action13

<scribe> *ACTION:* Guus to mail his position on issues 72, 73 and 75 to
the list [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/13-swd-minutes.html#action25] *[CONTINUES]*

<scribe> *ACTION:* Margherita to send an email on the need to keep
symbolic labels [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/13-swd-minutes.html#action24] *[DONE]*

see http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2008May/0031.html

<Margherita> found a property that could cover this
... different use case require futher information such as language and
provenance (e.g. location)
... wondering if these type of annotation can be added with current
vocabulary.

<seanb> see resolution forissue 79
<http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/track/issues/79>
... is that enough for use-case needs?

<Margherita> asked if language tags could be added as part of this
solution
... description of the problem w.r.t. concept potassium requiring
language tag for the symbol
... the relation should be at the concept level.

<aliman> explained that plain literals would allow language tags
... but that skos:notation was using RDF datatype literals which
included a lexical label and a datatype URI
... see RDF Concepts on literals
<http://www.w3.org/TR/rdf-concepts/#section-Literals>
... doesn't make sense to have a language tag on a typed literal
... ex:Potassium skos:prefLabel "Potassium"@en; skos:prefLabel
"K"@en-x-notation
... as per Jakob's proposal for using prefLabel.
<http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2008Jan/0211.html>

<Margherita> says that the problem with skos:notation is that the
language tag
... can not be added to RDF datatype literals

<qhreul> proposed to extend skos:altLabel instead
... ex:chemicalSymbol rdf:subProperty skos:altLabel

<seanb> "A resource has no more than one value of skos:prefLabel per
language"
... suggesting that we can have multiple prefLabel.

<aliman> says that both are possible patterns.
... prefSymbol and altSymbol were based on annotating pictures

<Margherita> likes the idea of creating sub properties of altLabel
... as would be able to create multiple annotation and add language with
them

<aliman> says that Margherita use case is the main one w.r.t. to
annotation
... why the using annotation?

<Antoine> annotation are closer to datatype literals, but doesn't allow
to define the language

<aliman> Brian says that rationale is that it can be defined within an
XML literal

<Antoine> says that it could be difficult for people to implement

<aliman> datatypes handled outside RDF semantics - notion of
lexical-to-value mapping is something specific to each datatype - no
necessity that datatype URI link to anything
... how you link the data to datatype was an issue in previous WG.
... idea that most people would use SKOS notation and coin URI specific
to their notation system and if they wanted to go further declare their
own datatype

sean: if Margherita use prefLabel then she will use different label with
same language to represent both terms and symbols

<aliman> ex:Potassium skos:prefLabel "Potassium"@en; skos:prefLabel
"K"@en-x-symbol. # another way to do it?

<Margherita>"Potassium" would be the prefLabel, whereas the P would be a
chemical label associated to a altLabel

<seanb> It seems the question is whether a chemical symbol should be
considered a "notation".

<Margherita> Not sure if there is a need for this to be another
prefLabel

<aliman> # using notations :
ex:Potassium
... skos:prefLabel "Potassium"@en;
... skos:notation "K"^^<http://example.com/chemical-symbols>
<http://example.com/chemical-symbols%3E>

<aliman> # duplicating the symbol label:
ex:Potassium
... skos:prefLabel "Potassium"@en;
... skos:prefLabel "K"@en-x-chemicalsymbol
... skos:notation "K"^^<http://example.com/chemical-symbols>
<http://example.com/chemical-symbols%3E>.

<seanb> If it is, then our patterns don't quite capture Margherita's
requirements

marghe: is afraid that we might get a lot of different solution to do
the same things

<seanb> Alistair's solution doesn't include the language for the
notation

<aliman> says that skos:notation should normally be used unless
... you need to say something about the language as well.

<aliman> proposes to use skos:note

<seanb> says that notation should be across all languages

<aliman> using example of syrilic language and whether the same notation
is used
... Periodic table in Russian, uses latin symbols!
<http://www.jergym.hiedu.cz/~canovm/vyhledav/varianty/russian.html>
... another russian language periodic table using latin symbols :)
<http://www.chem.msu.su/rus/history/element/>

<seanb> I think we need to see these examples worked through (not just
in the irc :-)

<aliman> +1 on what seanb said :)

<scribe> *ACTION:* Margherita to liase with author primer about example
using plain literals and some with datatype literals [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/20-swd-minutes.html#action17]


      RDFa

Ben: we have had feedback from WG on the primer
... suggesting that we are very close to the end
... prob will take a couple of weeks as still need to work on the syntax
... currently closing issues at moment
... currently implementing against the use-case
... currently a java parser and also have a javascript parser
... all dates in the agenda are within the reach of the task force

<scribe> *ACTION:* Ben to prepare draft implementation report for RDFa
(with assistance from Michael) [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/01/22-swd-minutes.html#action14] *[CONTINUES]*

Ben: if anyone wants to have a look @ the latest draft, the taskforce
would be happy about feedback


      Recipe

Tom: the working draft has been reviewed

<scribe> *ACTION:* Ralph propose resolution to ISSUE-16 "Default
behavior" [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2007/01/22-swd-minutes.html#action14] *[CONTINUES]*

<scribe> *ACTION:* Ralph/Diego to work on Wordnet implementation [of
Recipes implementations] [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/01/22-swd-minutes.html#action20] *[CONTINUES]*

Diego: pending on work done on W3C web services

<scribe> *ACTION:* Jon will correct the PURL references in the recipes
and update the files in W3space [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/04/29-swd-minutes.html#action12] *[DONE]*

see http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2008May/0038.html

<scribe> *ACTION:* Jon and Diego to publish a new Editor's Draft of the
Recipes [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2008/05/13-swd-minutes.html#action04] *[DONE]*

see http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2008May/0038.html


<scribe> *ACTION:* Ralph to review the new Editor's Draft of the Recipes
[recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/05/13-swd-minutes.html#action06]
*[CONTINUES]*

<scribe> *ACTION:* Ed to review the new Editor's Draft of the Recipes
[recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/05/13-swd-minutes.html#action05]
*[CONTINUES]*


      Vocabulary Management

Vit: submitted changes to Eliza that Eliza is going to implement


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Received on Wednesday, 21 May 2008 08:31:27 GMT

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