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Re: [minutes] SVG IG Conf Call Dec 4th

From: Donald Doherty <donald.doherty@brainstage.com>
Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 15:19:18 -0500
Message-Id: <08B122EB-E44A-4C8D-A266-934F4EE88886@brainstage.com>
To: SVG IG List <public-svg-ig@w3.org>
Hi All,

Sorry that I was unable to make it to the meeting last week. We're  
completing our beta 2 build tomorrow!

On reviewing the minutes I noticed Brainstage came up. Just wanted to  
point out that I'm with Brainstage (for those who didn't know). I'm  
not sure how far the discussions have progressed (I'm catching up on  
email right now) but I hope we can help with SVG Open 2009!

Best wishes,
Don

Donald Doherty, Ph.D.
Founder and Chief Science Officer
Brainstage, Inc.
www.brainstage.com
donald.doherty@brainstage.com
412-683-1410


On Dec 6, 2008, at 5:04 PM, Doug Schepers wrote:

>
> Hi, Folks-
>
> The minutes for the SVG IG Dec 4 teleconference can be found here:
>
> http://www.w3.org/2008/12/04-svgig-minutes.html
>
> Or as plain text below:
>
>   [1]W3C
>
>      [1] http://www.w3.org/
>
>                               - DRAFT -
>
>                   SVG Interest Group Teleconference
>
> 04 Dec 2008
>
>   See also: [2]IRC log
>
>      [2] http://www.w3.org/2008/12/04-svgig-irc
>
> Attendees
>
>   Present
>          Doug_Schepers, JeffSchiller, gwadej, Rob_Russell, Manuel,
>          Dave_Porter
>
>   Regrets
>   Chair
>          SV_MEETING_CHAIR
>
>   Scribe
>          Rob_Russell
>
> Contents
>
>     * [3]Topics
>         1. [4]svgopen 2009
>         2. [5]Mozilla, SVG WG
>         3. [6]Community Website
>     * [7]Summary of Action Items
>     _________________________________________________________
>
>
>
>   <JeffSchiller> give me a couple mins here
>
>   <shepazu> sure
>
>   <trackbot> Date: 04 December 2008
>
>   howdy
>
>   i'm the 1.149 number (caller id messed up on the voip)
>
>   <HelderMagalhaes> (just to ease on the logs and general
>   identification - also, I'll be following from IRC as usual :-) )
>
>   <aneumann> I am also just on IRC, not on the phone. I'd like to
>   discuss SVG Open in the first 10-15 minutes because I have to leave
>   then
>
>   <shepazu> scribeNick: Rob_Russell
>
> svgopen 2009
>
>   <aneumann> as you may have heard we did not find a local organizer
>   for SVG Open 2009 in California
>
>   <aneumann> our next lead is now Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania - David
>   Dailey is looking into it
>
>   <JeffSchiller> yes, i've seen some discussions about an alternate US
>   location, PA
>
>   <aneumann> a research company ([8]http://www.brainstage.com/) is
>   interested in helping with the organization
>
>      [8] http://www.brainstage.com/)
>
>   doug: penn is okay, CA is better
>
>   jeff: CA is more popular tech destination
>
>   <aneumann> yes, but without a local organizer its too risky
>
>   doug: mozilla has joined the SVG WG, hired Jonathan Watt for
>   fulltime svg dev
>
>   <aneumann> There is also Carnegie Mellon in Pittsburgh
>
>   <HelderMagalhaes> Rob_Russell: great to know about that! :-)
>
>   <aneumann> cool - good to hear abouth Jonathan
>
>   doug: jwatt previously worked for joost, was a memeber of the svg wg
>   and ig but joost has dropped svg
>   ... asked jwatt to see if moz would be interested in helping
>   organize
>
>   <aneumann> I hope that we have a decision about Pittsburgh before
>   Christmas and are able to put out information and Call for papers
>   before end of the year
>
>   doug: before going to a different location we should look into the
>   moz option
>
>   <aneumann> yes, the moz option would be fine also - but we'd need a
>   decision soon - we can't wait much longer
>
>   doug: jwatt may be able to get in on the IG calls within the next
>   week or so (but he is busy)
>
>   <aneumann> also Jwatt may be too busy with getting into Moz and not
>   sure he can devote much time to SVG Open
>
>   <aneumann> but he could help to get moz as a supporter/sponsor
>
>   <shepazu> aneumann, do you think it would bad to wait until January?
>
>   <shepazu> we could CfP before before the final location is announced
>
>   <aneumann> yes, it would be good to have decided on a location
>   before christmas
>
>   doug: could say PA and CA are being considered
>
>   <aneumann> hm - I don't know - we can already prepare the Cfp before
>   and then put it immediately live when we have the decision
>
>   <shepazu> I will respond more on the SVGOpen list
>
>   doug: having moz sponsor the open would be a "feather in the cap",
>   worth waiting a month (personal opinion) and CA would get more
>   people
>
>   jeff: agrees, CA is closer to tech stuff
>
>   <aneumann> ok - I have to leave now anyway. Lets discuss it further
>   on the SVG Open list
>
>   doug: higher profile conf puts more pressure on MS than a smaller
>   one
>
>   <aneumann> I wouldn't mind if someone else would take the lead who
>   is in better contact with moz than me
>
>   doug: ultimately Andreas' decision
>   ... will pursue Mozilla for a person to organize
>
>   <shepazu> I will contact other Moz people than jwatt, too
>
>   <aneumann> not only - I follow your advice
>
>   <aneumann> ok - thanks and bye for now ...
>
>   jeff: will jwatt be doing what tor was doing at moz?
>
>   doug: yes, jonathan said mozilla is going for Full SVG 1.1
>   compliance
>
>   jeff: interesting to see if we can get a plugin from Moz (for ie?)
>   that's fully supported
>
> Mozilla, SVG WG
>
>   doug: update from the SVG WG. Mozilla has joined. Most people aren't
>   in on the politics and pain of getting the browser vendors to
>   participate, this has been years in coming.
>   ... Dedicating a Mozilla employee to SVG is huge. Robert O'Calahan
>   has been proposing extensions to SVG for CSS, layout & positioning &
>   ease of authoring.
>   ... Don't think they'll simply do SVG 1.1 and that's all - more of a
>   long term dedication to SVG as part of an open web platform.
>   ... Despite some misgivings at the WG, we're going ahead with hixe's
>   proposal to do inline SVG in html5 (plain text html). The WG would
>   like feedback, especially use cases and tests.
>
>   jeff: I followed some of the discussion, hixie proposal is the less
>   rigid?
>
>   doug: hixie's proposal allows for error correction. In html5 it's
>   not considered an error (badly formed dom) but in XML SVG it would
>   be.
>
>   jeff: I don't mind going along with html5ish way as long as there's
>   a way to export the SVG dom as XML
>
>   doug: that's something this group could do, come up with test cases
>   & use cases
>
>   wade: do we have a pointer to this spec?
>
>   doug: will ask hixie to make a version available
>   ... you basically have to understand all of html5 to get it
>
>   jeff: there's some contention but michael smith put out a spec for
>   just the parsing
>
>   doug: the edge cases might not show up there
>
>   jeff: font element & text area clash with elements in html, worried
>   about how that will work
>
>   doug: WG is taking a hard line in that case, no whitelist or
>   blacklist of elements or attributes for svg in html
>   ... may lose things like entities
>
>   jeff: not a big loss to me
>
>   doug: illustrator uses entities heavily
>   ... thinking of making an SVG Tidy that would replace entities and
>   strip out unneeded namespaces
>
>   jeff: sam ruby made a post that ranks highly about scrubbing svg -
>   google SVG Tidy (written in ruby language)
>
>   <scribe> ACTION: shepazu to publish version of HTML5 SVG syntax
>   [recorded in
>   [9]http://www.w3.org/2008/12/04-svgig-minutes.html#action01]
>
>   <trackbot> Created ACTION-15 - Publish version of HTML5 SVG syntax
>   [on Doug Schepers - due 2008-12-11].
>
>   rob: it'd be nice to get this covered on This Week In HTML5 (mark
>   pilgrim)
>
>   doug: discussed SVG in HTML with the HTML WG at the tech plenary
>   ... I think hixie's plan will win out over passing SVG to a strict
>   parser
>   ... this could have implications for standalone content as well
>   ... it's possible that other browsers would have to understand this
>   syntax which could be disruptive to existing SVG toolchains
>
> Community Website
>
>   jeff: last time we talked about generating content & rob would keep
>   up on theming
>
>   <JeffSchiller> rob: has put up a version of the theme on planetsvg
>
>   <shepazu> [10]http://www.planetsvg.com/
>
>     [10] http://www.planetsvg.com/
>
>   <JeffSchiller> rob: go to planetsvg.com, log in, My Account > Edit,
>   then choose the "Genesis_psc1"
>
>   <JeffSchiller> rob: then click save, the site will change theme
>
>   <JeffSchiller> rob: this theme is still a draft, lots of visual
>   quirks
>
>   <JeffSchiller> rob: so things are moving along, want people to take
>   a look, but I'm aware there are problems
>
>   <JeffSchiller> rob: might want to put the background in so it
>   doesn't look so white-on-dark
>
>   <JeffSchiller> jeff: are you looking for feedback yet?
>
>   <JeffSchiller> rob: might make more sense for me to get it a little
>   closer to 'done'
>
>   <JeffSchiller> manuel: can i download the theme so i can work on it
>   and submit it back?
>
>   <JeffSchiller> jeff: can you email him a tgz?
>
>   <JeffSchiller> rob: will do
>
>   <JeffSchiller> doug: is there a feed for news items?
>
>   <JeffSchiller> rob: i believe it's possible, but not sure why its'
>   not available yet
>
>   jeff: maybe we need a global feed, news tutorials, we should discuss
>   what feeds we need exactly
>
>   <HelderMagalhaes> JeffSchiller: Yes, having the possibility to
>   syndicate to specific feed was rather useful
>
>   <HelderMagalhaes> For example, a developer might
>
>   <HelderMagalhaes> just want news, an artist might prefer the
>   uploaded images feed
>
>   <JeffSchiller> Helder: yes, i'll starta little page for this on the
>   SVG IG wiki
>
>   rob: we need to decide on blockers from "prime time"
>
>   theme, feeds, primary navigation
>
>   jeff: will start a wiki page on rss feeds
>   ... we should discuss content on the site
>   ... I did a tutorial, shiny buttons, I wasn't sure of the format of
>   the content.I hosted images and svg on my site. How do we do this
>   going forward?
>
>   rob: there's g2 and there are image modules for drupal
>   ... I think we should use a drupal image/gallery module
>
>   jeff: if images were uploadable then it'd be easier to create
>   content. Maybe authors who need js could ship their files to an
>   admin who could post it
>
>   rob: good idea
>
>   jeff: rasters are easy, for svg & js standalone we'd want the author
>   to send that to an admin
>   ... we'd need to decide on paths
>
>   rob: we could publish guidelines for that
>
>   doug: I've hacked mediawiki to allow svg, I think it was using
>   IFRAME but OBJECT might be better now
>   ... Wondering if we could combine upload with another problem.
>   Helping people on irc I use pastebin, it's generic but we need a
>   dedicated svg pastebin.
>   ... Ideally it would show the svg source and the image
>
>   rob: sounds good, like a standalone site though
>
>   doug: maybe a subdomain on planetsvg
>   ... it'd be nice to be able to highlight code on a pastebin too
>
>   <HelderMagalhaes> Yeah, having a raster feature for a paste bin
>   would be great!
>
>   rob: i think there could be xss issues with that
>
>   <HelderMagalhaes> (even if limited to static SVG only, which would
>   be the natural option for security reasons...)
>
>   doug: that could be avoided by stripping out all js
>
>   <HelderMagalhaes> maybe using a rasterizer? rsvg or Batik
>   server-side
>
>   <HelderMagalhaes> (that could also help new users to try SVG even
>   without local support (in IE, of course)
>
>   <HelderMagalhaes> )
>
>   doug: it'd be nice if, at least, people could paste their svg in an
>   edit box and use that as a way to add images to the gallery
>
>   <stelt> HelderMagalhaes: i have a GUI for a rasterizer service
>   somewhere
>
>   <gwadej> I've got to run to a meeting.
>
>   jeff: to make things easier for authors, maybe we could allow people
>   to upload js & svg then an admin/mod approves it
>
>   rob: yes, i think that's a great role for a specific type of
>   moderator
>
>   <HelderMagalhaes> stelt: Yes, I know about it, but the idea was
>   allowing that online (server-side) or client side for click-and-see
>   experience like in w3schools. For example,
>   [11]http://www.w3schools.com/js/tryit.asp?filename=try_dom_form_subm
>   it
>
>     [11] http://www.w3schools.com/js/tryit.asp?filename=try_dom_form_submit
>
>   <DavePorter> Sorry guys, I have to drop off! Thanks for the meeting
>   and hearing about recent progress.
>
>   jeff: might try to put out a part 2 to the aqua button tutorial a
>   week or so from now
>
>   doug: i'd like to do a follow up to the button tutorial but
>   different
>   ... try to start new telcon time in the new year
>
> Summary of Action Items
>
>   [NEW] ACTION: shepazu to publish version of HTML5 SVG syntax
>   [recorded in
>   [12]http://www.w3.org/2008/12/04-svgig-minutes.html#action01]
>
>   [End of minutes]
> htm
>
>
Received on Thursday, 11 December 2008 20:20:01 UTC

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