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RE: [pub-sw-lifesci] [sic] Re: Lack of prefix in public-semweb-lifesci Subject line makes it difficult to recognize origin

From: Joanne Luciano <jluciano@predmed.com>
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 2006 11:44:45 -0500
To: "'Michal Galdzicki'" <mgaldzic@gmail.com>, "'Bob Futrelle'" <bob.futrelle@gmail.com>
Cc: "'Simon J. Hernandez'" <simon@w3.org>, "'hclsig-pub'" <public-semweb-lifesci@w3.org>, <jluciano@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <01d101c62685$a54d72e0$6702a8c0@predmed.local>

Hi Michal and others, 

I'd like to move on, because this is really off topic, however, I would like
to understand what problem is.  

How is it that I can get, by default, without asking, an email from the
Protégé list (and others), like this:

	-----Original Message-----
	From: protege-users-bounce@crg-gw.Stanford.EDU
[mailto:protege-users-bounce@crg-	gw.Stanford.EDU] On Behalf Of Monica
Crubezy
	Sent: Monday, January 30, 2006 1:54 PM
	To: protege-users@SMI.Stanford.EDU;
protege-discussion@SMI.Stanford.EDU; protege-	owl@SMI.Stanford.EDU
	Subject: [protege-users] Protege Short Course - Stanford University
- March 	28th-31st, 2006

that identifies "[Protégé-users] in the "Subject" but not from this mailing
list?

Why is this hard? Why is this an issue?

I really don't understand.

Thank you.

Joanne

> -----Original Message-----
> From: public-semweb-lifesci-request@w3.org 
> [mailto:public-semweb-lifesci-request@w3.org] On Behalf Of 
> Michal Galdzicki
> Sent: Tuesday, January 31, 2006 9:36 AM
> To: Bob Futrelle
> Cc: Simon J. Hernandez; hclsig-pub
> Subject: Re: [pub-sw-lifesci] [sic] Re: Lack of prefix in 
> public-semweb-lifesci Subject line makes it difficult to 
> recognize origin
> 
> 
> please take the non topic disscussion of the list.
> thanks
> 
> On 1/31/06, Bob Futrelle <bob.futrelle@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > I would still like to see some workarounds for the ten year 
> interval 
> > between now and when vendors respond to:
> >
> > "If your mail client software does not provide these 
> features, please 
> > file a bug report with your software vendor."
> >
> > I'm not sure how much luck the Internet Society will have 
> persuading 
> > Microsoft, Google, Eudora, Yahoo, and the unix Pine and Elm 
> authors to 
> > become the ideal citizens that they and the W3C would like 
> them to be.
> > Not to mention, educating the users of the clients to 
> understand how 
> > to deal with the List-Id.  There are zillions of email users out 
> > there, who simply want to see right in front of them, the 
> information 
> > that describes what they're reading, rather than asking 
> them to step 
> > up a level in their clients and their understanding of 
> their client's 
> > settings and operations.  How about email to cell phones and PDAs?
> > The list of problems goes on and on.
> >
> > In the meantime, I personally will continue to manage my 
> own various 
> > GNU Mailman lists that have a built-in ability to include a prefix 
> > automatically.  And I will continue to add prefixes to my mail, 
> > [pub-sw-lifesci] , unless the W3C feels it's an egregious 
> violation of 
> > the spirit of the RFC.
> >
> > I find that it's particularly important to have a meaningful prefix 
> > for a person who receives their *first* mail from a 
> particular list, 
> > which they might not otherwise recognize.
> >
> > The RFC is asking a lot of the vendors, and that was 5 
> years ago now 
> > (!). RFC documents don't solve problems, they just set 
> standards that 
> > they *hope* will come about.  I think the US, for example, has 
> > officially adopted the metric system, the whole nine yards.  The 
> > practice hasn't caught up yet.
> >
> > How many more years do we have to wait for Email Utopia?
> >
> >  - Bob Futrelle
> >
> >
> > On 1/31/06, Simon J. Hernandez <simon@w3.org> wrote:
> > > Hi Bob.
> > >
> > > On Sat, 28 Jan 2006, Bob Futrelle wrote:
> > >
> > > > This note is for Simon J. Hernandez who handles mailing 
> lists at 
> > > > W3C, among many other things.
> > > >
> > > > Point being that the  points I made below resulted in about 20 
> > > > emails in the public-semweb-lifesci@w3.org list. Many 
> of the notes 
> > > > discussed changing settings on their email clients to 
> allow them 
> > > > to distinguish mail from public-semweb-lifesci@w3.org 
> from other 
> > > > incoming mail.  But a number did agree that having the list 
> > > > administrator set a prefix for the subject line would work in 
> > > > every single client, since they all show the leading 
> portion of the subject line in their summaries.
> > >
> > >
> > > Interestingly, our discussion has been focused on how to 
> get vendors 
> > > to fix their brokenness and use existent RFCs.
> > >
> > > Our Postmaster, Gerald Oskoboiny, has now documented our 
> position[1] 
> > > on this matter, which has strong consensus in the W3C 
> Systems Team.
> > >
> > >
> > > > Essentially all the discussion of this issue in this 
> list so far 
> > > > has focused on the client side.  I think that a number 
> of us would 
> > > > like to see a solution from the mailing list server 
> side, the list 
> > > > management side.  A short prefix such as 
> [pub-sw-lifesci] sounds 
> > > > reasonable.  If such could automatically be added to 
> all outgoing 
> > > > list mail then we would be able to identify mail from "unknown 
> > > > parties" who turn out to be people  addressing the list. 
> > > > Personally, in this day and age, I have to be 
> suspicious of email 
> > > > I get from people I don't know, with perhaps a subject 
> that doesn't make it clear that it's from this list.
> > > >  A prefix would also help me make a quick decision as 
> to whether I 
> > > > want to open the mail now or later as I scan my bulging inbox.
> > >
> > > ...
> > >
> > > As discussed in the above noted document, there is a standard, 
> > > RFC-documented method to accomplish the same thing.
> > >
> > > We are always open to discussing systems issues, and we 
> try to come 
> > > to some mutually agreed upon solution to address most 
> problems.  In 
> > > this instance, your request prodded us to focus and and 
> document our 
> > > dirrection on this topic.
> > >
> > > I apologize if this is not the outcome you hoped for, but we feel 
> > > using the existing RFCs and placing the burden of such 
> functionality 
> > > on the vendors of mail clients, is the more practical of 
> the possible outcomes.
> > >
> > > Cheers.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Simon
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > 1.  http://www.w3.org/Mail/subject-tagging
> > >
> > > --
> > > Simon J. Hernandez    |    http://people.w3.org/simon/
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Robert P. Futrelle
> >     Associate Professor
> > Biological Knowledge Laboratory
> > College of Computer and Information Science Northeastern 
> University MS 
> > WVH202 360 Huntington Ave.
> > Boston, MA 02115
> >
> > Office: (617)-373-4239
> > Fax:    (617)-373-5121
> > http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/futrelle
> > http://www.bionlp.org
> > http://www.diagrams.org
> > http://biologicalknowledge.com
> >
> >
> 
> 
> 
Received on Tuesday, 31 January 2006 16:45:01 GMT

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