Re: audiobook options in objects

To clarify - I don't have a problem with the use of additionalType generally or in declaring a creativeWork to also be a Product - it just seemed it didn't actually resolve the issue I described. 

But just feeling my way here so happy if I've misinterpreted how this can work

Owen

On 9 Feb 2013, at 18:21, "Young,Jeff (OR)" <jyoung@oclc.org> wrote:

> Why so much concern about schema:additionalType and Microdata as opposed to rdf:type and RDFa? This isn't an issue from the latter POV. The thing is both types.
> 
> Jeff
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> On Feb 9, 2013, at 1:10 PM, "Owen Stephens" <owen@ostephens.com> wrote:
> 
>> Thanks.  Will try to adjust proposal and modelling in this direction
>> 
>> The example you've pointed at uses /Product as an 'additionaltype' which doesn't seem right to me - my inclination would be to propose a creative work can be associated with a product in someway. 
>> 
>> I see that creativeWork can have an 'offer' associated with it which seems counterintuitive - would be much nicer if this became a link to a product instead? 
>> 
>> Feel like my thinking is going round in circles :(
>> 
>> Owen
>> 
>> 
>> On 9 Feb 2013, at 16:05, "Young,Jeff (OR)" <jyoung@oclc.org> wrote:
>> 
>>> Owen,
>>> 
>>> I think you're on the right track.
>>> 
>>> I would argue that schema:CreativeWork should be used to represent "content" and schema:Product be used to represent "carrier". FRBR Manifestation is then an amalgamation of schema:CreativeWork and schema:ProductModel. FRBR Item would be schema:CreativeWork and schema:IndividualProduct. Our notion of "Holding" would be schema:creativeWork and schema:SomeProducts.
>>> 
>>> I believe that Richard started to mock up an example on the wiki.
>>> 
>>> http://www.w3.org/community/schemabibex/wiki/Examples/mylib
>>> 
>>> Jeff
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>> 
>>> On Feb 9, 2013, at 10:42 AM, "Owen Stephens" <owen@ostephens.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Looking at this again I think what I feel most unhappy with the modelling I've done is:
>>>> 
>>>> A) It treats something that is 16 CDs as essentially a single thing (says its a cd containing a 22hr CDDA encoded audio object
>>>> 
>>>> B) It conflates the format (cd) with the creative work. This would make it awkward to code a page which listed the work then multiple access options (audio cd, mp3 on physical media, mp3 for download, ogg vorbis for download etc)
>>>> 
>>>> If it were just multiple formats for download you could do this adequately using audioObject - but the mix in of physical media stops this.
>>>> 
>>>> Being able to this kind of listing seems pretty fundamental - whether for a library or a store.
>>>> 
>>>> It might be that this can be achieved by mixing in a schema.org/product? This would make more sense - the cd set is a product, as is the physical media+mp3, as is the mp3 for download.
>>>> 
>>>> However not quite sure how to model this right now.
>>>> 
>>>> Does my concern make sense?
>>>> Anyone want to suggest how product would interact here?
>>>> 
>>>> I think I'm sticking to a pretty straightforward real world scenario here not just dreaming up an abstract concern?
>>>> 
>>>> Owen
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> On 9 Feb 2013, at 03:57, Karen Coyle <kcoyle@kcoyle.net> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> > Great, owen. I'll work on proposal 2 since that seems to be the mostly likely one in my set. I'm not clear about repetition of property names in schema.org -- is it legit to have two schemas that both have a property "isbn"? I believe this was discussed either here or on the public-vocab list, and I was left with the impression that the URI pattern is
>>>> >
>>>> > http://schema.org/[property]
>>>> >
>>>> > and not
>>>> >
>>>> > http://schema.org/Book/[property]
>>>> > http://schema.org/Audiobook/[property]
>>>> >
>>>> > Can anyone confirm? Because that would knock out a couple of the options that are currently on the page.
>>>> >
>>>> > kc
>>>> >
>>>> > On 2/8/13 3:46 PM, Owen Stephens wrote:
>>>> >> OK - I've given markup a go for Proposal 5 - not done this before so likely be errors/misconceptions on my part so anyone should feel free to chip in and improve.
>>>> >> http://www.w3.org/community/schemabibex/wiki/Object_Types#Proposal_5
>>>> >> Owen
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Owen Stephens
>>>> >> Owen Stephens Consulting
>>>> >> Web: http://www.ostephens.com
>>>> >> Email: owen@ostephens.com
>>>> >> Telephone: 0121 288 6936
>>>> >>
>>>> >> On 8 Feb 2013, at 18:01, Karen Coyle <kcoyle@KCOYLE.NET> wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>> So many choices! :-) Should the next step be to try to encode a few items and see how it works?
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Also, the creativeWork "encoding" is *supposed* to be of type MediaObject. Does that make a difference?
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> kc
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> On 2/8/13 7:46 AM, Owen Stephens wrote:
>>>> >>>> Hi Karen,
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> I'm inclined to ignore that definition of Media Object :) There is no reason why an Audio-book shouldn't be embedded in a webpage so I wouldn't want to exclude this either)
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> I think you could make use of the Creative Work property "encoding" rather than making it a type of Media Object - which allows some split of content and carrier? (not wishing to resurrect that discussion!)
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> This would allow:
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> Proposal
>>>> >>>> Thing > CreativeWork > Audiobook
>>>> >>>> Thing > CreativeWork > Book > Audiobook
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> New properties for audiobook type
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>>    • readBy -- expected type: Person
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> Properties likely to be used from Book
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>>    • bookEdition (for abridgement note)
>>>> >>>>    • isbn
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> With a separate Media Object to be created and referenced using 'encoding' property from CreativeWork?
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> I've added as Proposal 4
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> Owen
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> Owen Stephens
>>>> >>>> Owen Stephens Consulting
>>>> >>>> Web: http://www.ostephens.com
>>>> >>>> Email: owen@ostephens.com
>>>> >>>> Telephone: 0121 288 6936
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> On 8 Feb 2013, at 15:23, Karen Coyle <kcoyle@kcoyle.net> wrote:
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>>> I wrote up three options for audiobook:
>>>> >>>>>
>>>> >>>>> http://www.w3.org/community/schemabibex/wiki/Object_Types#AudioBook
>>>> >>>>>
>>>> >>>>> A key question here is whether we can re-use MediaObject, since it is defined as being media embedded in a web page.
>>>> >>>>>
>>>> >>>>> kc
>>>> >>>>> --
>>>> >>>>> Karen Coyle
>>>> >>>>> kcoyle@kcoyle.net http://kcoyle.net
>>>> >>>>> ph: 1-510-540-7596
>>>> >>>>> m: 1-510-435-8234
>>>> >>>>> skype: kcoylenet
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> --
>>>> >>> Karen Coyle
>>>> >>> kcoyle@kcoyle.net http://kcoyle.net
>>>> >>> ph: 1-510-540-7596
>>>> >>> m: 1-510-435-8234
>>>> >>> skype: kcoylenet
>>>> >
>>>> > --
>>>> > Karen Coyle
>>>> > kcoyle@kcoyle.net http://kcoyle.net
>>>> > ph: 1-510-540-7596
>>>> > m: 1-510-435-8234
>>>> > skype: kcoylenet
>>>> >
>>>> 
>>>> 

Received on Saturday, 9 February 2013 18:58:17 UTC