W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > public-rdf-wg@w3.org > October 2012

trig syntax resolutions

From: Sandro Hawke <sandro@w3.org>
Date: Wed, 03 Oct 2012 10:15:55 -0400
Message-ID: <506C489B.9010903@w3.org>
To: W3C RDF WG <public-rdf-wg@w3.org>
Sorry I didn't gather together people's responses until now.    It looks 
to me like we probably have consensus on the following points:

1. PROPOSED: We will produce a W3C Recommendation for a dataset syntax, 
similar to TriG and to SPARQL's named graph syntax.

2. PROPOSED: We'll request a media-type for this syntax which is 
different from the media-type for Turtle.  (That is, we will not 
consider this language to supplant Turtle and take over the name, 
becoming the new "Turtle", as was once proposed.)

3. PROPOSED: Our dataset syntax will allow for the expression of empty 
named graphs, whatever their semantics might be (to be decided). The 
syntax is an empty curly-braces expression, as in "<g> { }".

4. PROPOSED: We will call our recommended dataset syntax "TriG", but 
informally and in the media type, "trig".

5. PROPOSED: In our dataset syntax, a "=" MUST NOT appear between the 
name and the graph.

6. PROPOSED: In our dataset syntax, the case-insensitive keyword "graph" 
MUST NOT appear before the name, in a name-graph pair.

On the other issues, there's no consensus.  We probably have to flip a 
coin between whether the default graph MUST or MAY be in curly braces.

Everyone's votes and small comments are collated below, hopefully 
without error.   I didn't even bother to gather the responses to the 
metadata-mechanics questions because they were so generally negative.

          -- Sandro

========




PROPOSED: We will produce a W3C Recommendation for a dataset syntax, 
similar to TriG and to SPARQL's named graph syntax.

Lee: +1
Pat: +1
Gavin: +1
AZ: +1
Andy: +1 and n-quads as well
Gregg: +1
David: +1
Ivan: +1
Steve: +0.5 maybe it's a little early?


PROPOSED: We'll request a media-type for this syntax which is different 
from the media-type for Turtle.  (That is, we will not consider this 
language to supplant Turtle and take over the name, becoming the new 
"Turtle", as was once proposed.)

Lee: +1
Gavin: +1
AZ: +1
Andy: +1 and application/n-quads as well
Gregg: -0 TriG is not Turtle
David: +1
Ivan: +1
Steve: +1


PROPOSED: Our dataset syntax will allow for the expression of empty 
named graphs, whatever their semantics might be (to be decided). The 
syntax is an empty curly-braces expression, as in "<g> { }".

Lee: +1
Pat: +1
AZ: +1
Andy: +1
Gregg: -0 Expression of empty graph is okay, but querrying for an empty 
graph is difficult in quad-based datastores
David: +0
Ivan: +1
Steve: -0.5 - don't see the need for this, and I've never seen it in the 
wild.


PROPOSED: Our dataset syntax will have some standard mechanism (to be 
determined within the next few weeks) through which a Dataset 
serialization can include some RDF data about the Dataset (that is, some 
metadata in the form of an RDF graph).

Lee: -0
Pat: +1
Gavin: -0.5
AZ: +0 prefer that this is defined outside the Working Group,
Andy: -0 (I would like to see this as describing good practice. It 
should not be a syntax issue.  -0.5 to mandating anything.  Too 
early/unproven. )
Gregg: +1
David: +1 (I think this is important)
Steve: -0.5 - prefer to see a design emerge, rather than design by 
committee guesswork

Below, there are groups of proposals which are alternative solutions to 
a design issue.   If you approve of more than one of the alternatives, 
please vote "+2" for your favorite.

* Name of the dataset syntax


PROPOSED: We will call our recommended dataset syntax "trig", 
capitalized to Trig as needed.

Lee: 0
Gavin: 0
Andy: 0
Gregg: 0
Ivan: +1


PROPOSED: We will call our recommended dataset syntax "TriG", but 
informally and in the media type, "trig".

Lee: +1
Gavin: +1
Andy: +1
Gregg: +1
Ivan: -0.5


PROPOSED: We will call our recommended dataset syntax "TriG", and use 
that capitalization everywhere.

Lee: -0
Gavin: -0
Andy: -0.5  Media types are normally LC.
Gregg: -0
Ivan: -0.5  (maybe Turtle+, etc)


* Use of equals sign, like <g> = { <s> <p> <o> } .  This is not in 
SPARQL but is in traditional TriG, for compatibility with N3.

Gavin: N3 = does not mean TriG = .


PROPOSED: In our dataset syntax, a "=" MAY appear between the name and 
the graph.

Lee: +1
Gavin: -0.9 implies an equality relationship
AZ: close to -1
Andy: -0.8  (and only a mere touch of compatibility stops that being -0.99)
Gregg: +0
David: +1
Ivan: -0.5
Steve: -1 - optional syntax is bad


PROPOSED: In our dataset syntax, a "=" MUST appear between the name and 
the graph.

Lee: -1
Gavin: -1
AZ: -1
Andy: -0.99
Gregg: -0.5
David: +0
Ivan: -0.5
Steve: -1  - people don't do this in the wild


PROPOSED: In our dataset syntax, a "=" MUST NOT appear between the name 
and the graph.

Lee: 0
Gavin: +1
AZ: +1
Andy: +1
Gregg: -+.5
David: +0
Ivan: +1
Steve: +1




* Use of the "graph" keyword, which MUST be used in SPARQL and MUST NOT 
be used in traditional TriG.

PROPOSED: In our dataset syntax, the case-insensitive keyword "graph" 
MAY appear before the name, in a name-graph pair.

Lee: -0
Gavin: -0.5 The whole syntax is about graphs, why do I need to say graph 
a lot?
AZ: prefer not
Andy: +0.1
Gregg: -0
David: +0
Ivan: +1 but it should be 'GRAPH' (per SPARQL), not 'graph'
Steve: -1  Either MUST or MUST NOT, pick one


PROPOSED: In our dataset syntax, the case-insensitive keyword "graph" 
MUST appear before the name, in a name-graph pair.

Lee: -1
Gavin: -1
AZ: -1
Andy: -0.99
Gregg: -1
David: +0
Ivan: -0.5


PROPOSED: In our dataset syntax, the case-insensitive keyword "graph" 
MUST NOT appear before the name, in a name-graph pair.

Lee: 0
Gavin: +1
AZ: +1
Andy: 0
Gregg: +0.5
David: -0.5
Ivan: -0.5
Steve: +1




* Use of curly braces { <a> <b> <c> } around the default graphs.   They 
MUST be used in traditional TriG, and MUST NOT be used in SPARQL.

Lee: (Not really true, FWIW. In SPARQL you can put curly braces pretty 
much wherever you want. )
Gavin: I prefer @default or DEFAULT <graph-iri>

PROPOSED: In our dataset syntax, triples of the dataset's default graph 
MAY be surrounded by curly braces.

Lee: 0
Gavin: -0
AZ: +1
Andy: +0
Gregg: +1
David: +0
Ivan: +1
Steve: +0

PROPOSED: In our dataset syntax, triples of the dataset's default graph 
MUST be surrounded by curly braces.

Lee: 0
Gavin: -0
AZ: +0
Andy: +0.5
Gregg: 0
David: +0.5
Ivan: -0.5
Steve: +1 - to avoid Turtle / TriG confusion.


PROPOSED: In our dataset syntax, triples of the dataset's default graph 
MUST NOT be surrounded by curly braces.

Lee: -1
Gavin: -1
AZ: +0 (it would be nice that a Turtle file can be interpreted as a TriG 
file for convenience)
Andy: -0.99   Caution: "n-quads in TriG"
Gregg: -0.5
David: -0.5
Ivan: -0.5
Steve: -1 to avoid Turtle / TriG confusion
Received on Wednesday, 3 October 2012 14:16:12 GMT

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