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Re: meeting record: 2008-10-02 RDFa Telecon

From: Steven Pemberton <steven.pemberton@cwi.nl>
Date: Mon, 06 Oct 2008 13:12:55 +0200
To: "Ralph R. Swick" <swick@w3.org>, public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf@w3.org, public-swd-wg@w3.org
Message-ID: <op.uiln3t1vsmjzpq@acer3010>

I did send regrets:

	http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2008Sep/0145.html

Steven

On Thu, 02 Oct 2008 19:46:37 +0200, Ralph R. Swick <swick@w3.org> wrote:

> The record of today's RDF-in-XHTML Task Force telecon is now available
>
>   http://www.w3.org/2008/10/02-rdfa-minutes.html
>
> A text snapshot follows.
>
> ----
>
>                         RDF-in-XHTML Task Force
>
> 02 Oct 2008
>
>    [2]Agenda
>
>       [2]  
> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2008Oct/0008.html
>
>    See also: [3]IRC log, previous [4]2008-09-18
>
>       [3] http://www.w3.org/2008/10/02-rdfa-irc
>       [4] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/18-rdfa-minutes.html
>
> Attendees
>
>    Present
>           Jeremy Carroll, Ralph Swick, Ben Adida, Mark Birbeck
>
>    Regrets
>           Michael Hausenblas, Shane McCarron
>
>    Chair
>           Ben
>
>    Scribe
>           Ralph
>
> Contents
>
>      * Topics
>          1. Action Review
>          2. Primer
>      * Summary of Action Items
>      _____________________________________________________
>
> Action Review
>
>    ACTION: [CONTINUES] Ben to close loop with Danny. [recorded in
>    [9]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/18-rdfa-minutes.html#action19]
>
>       [9] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/18-rdfa-minutes.html#action19
>
>    Ben: [10]wrote to Danny, don't have a response
>
>      [10]  
> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2008Sep/0122.html
>
>    ACTION: [DONE] Ben to determine how to highlight RDFa at TPAC
>    [recorded in
>    [11]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/18-rdfa-minutes.html#action17]
>
>      [11] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/18-rdfa-minutes.html#action17
>
>    Ralph: 2 opportunities
>
>    -> [12]TP Agenda
>
>      [12] http://www.w3.org/2008/10/TPAC/TPDay-Agenda.html
>
>    Ralph: 2 lightning talk sessions
>    ... also a "Semantic Web Demo" session
>
>    Jeremy, Mark: we'll be at TP
>
>    Ben: showing the Drupal work, or SearchMonkey, or Ubiquity w/RDFa
>    would be good
>    ... we have more showy stuff than last year
>
>    Ralph: let Ivan know if you have a brief demo you could offer
>
>    Jeremy: I might offer a demo
>
>    ACTION: [DONE] Ben to log Danny's issue to tracker. [recorded in
>    [13]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/18-rdfa-minutes.html#action18]
>
>      [13] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/18-rdfa-minutes.html#action18
>
>    -> [14]issue 128; PR Comment: Default Graph
>
>      [14] http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/track/issues/128
>
>    ACTION: [CONTINUES] Mark create base wizard suitable for cloning
>    [recorded in
>    [15]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action12]
>
>      [15] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action12
>
>    ACTION: [CONTINUES] Mark write foaf examples for wiki [recorded in
>    [16]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action13]
>
>      [16] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action13
>
>    ACTION: [DONE] Ben to figure out *how* to do the namespace-doc GRDDL
>    thing [recorded in
>    [17]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action18]
>
>      [17] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action18
>
>    Ben: Ralph went ahead and did it
>
>    ACTION: [DROPPED] Jeremy review and consider expanding the
>    description of TopBraid in the RDFa wiki [recorded in
>    [18]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action02]
>
>      [18] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action02
>
>    ACTION: [CONTINUES] Jeremy to demonstrate GRDDL with XHTML/RDFa once
>    the NS URI is set up. [recorded in
>    [19]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action03]
>
>      [19] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action03
>
>    ACTION: [CONTINUES] Manu talk with Jamie McCarthy about an
>    AskSlashdot piece [recorded in
>    [20]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action04]
>
>      [20] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action04
>
>    ACTION: [DONE] Manu to upload test harness source code to W3C CVS.
>    [recorded in
>    [21]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action07]
>
>      [21] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action07
>
>    -> [22]RDFa CVS repository on dev.w3.org [30]
>
>      [22]  
> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2008Sep/0178.html
>      [30]  
> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2008Sep/0129.html
>
>    ACTION: [CONTINUES] Manu to write summary for Semantic Web Use Cases
>    for Ivan. [recorded in
>    [23]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action09]
>
>      [23] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action09
>
>    ACTION: [CONTINUES] Manu write the perl code for Slashdot. [recorded
>    in [24]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action11]
>
>      [24] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action11
>
>    ACTION: [CONTINUES] Michael to create 'RDFa for uF users' on RDFa
>    Wiki [recorded in
>    [25]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action14]
>
>      [25] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action14
>
>    ACTION: [CONTINUES] Ralph think about RSS+RDFa [recorded in
>    [26]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action15]
>
>      [26] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action15
>
>    ACTION: [DONE] Ralph to make [27]http://www.w3.org/2008/07/rdfa-xslt
>    happen [recorded in
>    [28]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action16]
>
>      [27] http://www.w3.org/2008/07/rdfa-xslt
>      [28] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action16
>
>    ACTION: [DONE] Shane to update XHTML ns document to point to new
>    XSLT URI [recorded in
>    [29]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action17]
>
>      [29] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action17
>
> Primer
>
>    Ralph: last day to request publication is 13 October
>    ... last pubs before TPAC will be 16 Oct
>
>    Ben: we've had a couple of negative comments about the Primer
>    ... I wish folk would send us pointers to their blogs
>    ... do we _need_ to beef it up?
>
>    Mark: I haven't looked at it in a while but I do remember having
>    some thoughts
>
>    -> [30]RDFa Trials and Travails ... [25]
>
>      [30]  
> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2008Sep/0129.html
>      [25] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action14
>
>    Ben: do we _want_ to be telling people how to define vocabularies in
>    this document?
>
>    Mark: we'd talked before about the purpose of the Primer
>    ... probably don't want to get into explaining custom vocabularies
>    ... but if we don't then perhaps we shouldn't mention them at all
>    ... we have a powerful system in RDFa but what really makes it
>    useful to Joe Public is when we drop namespace prefixes and make it
>    look more like microformats
>
>    <Ralph> [I disagree on Mark's last point but won't go into it in
>    this telecon]
>
>    Mark: maybe we just accept that our audience is folk who are
>    somewhat familiar with Semantic Web concepts
>
>    Ben: I propose to submit editorial changes only to the Working Group
>    next week and publish just small changes on 13 October
>    ... just enough modification to the Primer to address the comments a
>    little bit
>
>    Ralph: are there enough updates to be worth pushing for 13 Oct or
>    should the Primer just wait a bit longer?
>
>    Jeremy: delay REC?
>
>    Ralph: no, let's not delay REC
>
>    Ben: there's other introductory material as well, e.g. in the Wiki
>
>    Mark: but I do see the argument in favor of removing the section on
>    custom vocabularies
>
>    Ralph: there _are_ related documents out there; e.g. the Best
>    Practice Recipes
>
>    Mark: but where are the limits on what we do?
>
>    Ralph: one of the things that distinguishes RDFa from microformats
>    is that you _can_ define your own vocabulary when you decide that
>    there's nothing existing that meets your needs
>    ... so I wouldn't want to drop this entirely from the Primer
>    ... it's not clear whether that commentor tried to follow the URIs
>    ... the early Web was built on cloning pages; the same works for
>    these examples
>
>    ACTION: Ben ask Shane to produce an updated Syntax with editorial
>    changes for the WG to review next week [recorded in
>    [31]http://www.w3.org/2008/10/02-rdfa-minutes.html#action17]
>
>    -> "[32]xmlse:foo slightly substantive comment on CURIEs (both in
>    stand alone document, and in RDFa PR)" [Jeremy 2008-09-12] Jeremy's
>    editorial suggestion
>
>      [32]  
> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2008Sep/0041
>
>    <benadida> Note: A CURIE prefix value may case-insensitively begin
>    in the string "xml", but then it is not permitted to be used as a
>    prefix in an xmlns declaration in an XML document.
>
>    Jeremy: we should align the RDFa Syntax document and the CURIE spec
>    as to whether a prefix can start with 'xml'
>
>    <JeremyCarroll> See the text:
>
>    <JeremyCarroll> [[
>
>    <JeremyCarroll> prefix values MUST be able to be defined using the
>    'xmlns:' syntax specified in [XMLNAMES].
>
>    <JeremyCarroll> ]]
>
>    <markbirbeck> "When CURIES are used in an XML-based host language,
>    prefix values MUST be able to be defined using the 'xmlns:' syntax
>    specified in [XMLNAMES]. Such host languages MAY also provide
>    additional prefix mapping definition mechanisms.
>
>    <markbirbeck> When CURIES are used in a non-XML host language, the
>    host language MUST provide a mechanism for defining the mapping from
>    the prefix to an IRI."
>
>    Ralph: perhaps the 'xml' restriction is a Host Language restriction
>    and not an RDFa or CURIE restriction
>    ... so RDFa and CURIE should remain silent on this point and leave
>    it to the Host Language specs to declare any further restrictions
>
>    Mark: when I added that sentence I was thinking of prefixes such as
>    '123abc'
>    ... it wouldn't hurt to add to CURIE the 'xml*' restriction
>    ... I think this would be a useful addition
>
>    Ralph: I'd make it an editorial Note: comment rather than make it
>    appearing to be normative about CURIEs
>
>    Mark: I agree that the normative constraint is already covered by
>    the "prefix values MUST be able to be defined using the 'xmlns:'
>    syntax specified in [XMLNAMES]" language
>    ... I'm suggesting adding the comment as assistance to readers
>
>    Jeremy: an example would be informative
>    ... I'm happy with no change to RDFa Syntax
>
>    <benadida> PROPOSE no modification to the RDFa Syntax document based
>    on Jeremy's xmlse:foo comment
>
>    RESOLUTION: no modification to the RDFa Syntax document based on
>    Jeremy's xmlse:foo comment
>
>    <JeremyCarroll> accepted as commentator
>
>    [adjourned]
>
> Summary of Action Items
>
>    [NEW] ACTION: Ben ask Shane to produce an updated Syntax with
>    editorial changes for the WG to review next week [recorded in
>    [33]http://www.w3.org/2008/10/02-rdfa-minutes.html#action17]
>
>    [PENDING] ACTION: Ben to close loop with Danny. [recorded in
>    [34]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/18-rdfa-minutes.html#action19]
>    [PENDING] ACTION: Jeremy to demonstrate GRDDL with XHTML/RDFa once
>    the NS URI is set up. [recorded in
>    [35]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action03]
>    [PENDING] ACTION: Manu talk with Jamie McCarthy about an AskSlashdot
>    piece [recorded in
>    [36]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action04]
>    [PENDING] ACTION: Manu to write summary for Semantic Web Use Cases
>    for Ivan. [recorded in
>    [37]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action09]
>    [PENDING] ACTION: Manu write the perl code for Slashdot. [recorded
>    in [38]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action11]
>    [PENDING] ACTION: Mark create base wizard suitable for cloning
>    [recorded in
>    [39]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action12]
>    [PENDING] ACTION: Mark write foaf examples for wiki [recorded in
>    [40]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action13]
>    [PENDING] ACTION: Michael to create 'RDFa for uF users' on RDFa Wiki
>    [recorded in
>    [41]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action14]
>    [PENDING] ACTION: Ralph think about RSS+RDFa [recorded in
>    [42]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action15]
>
>      [34] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/18-rdfa-minutes.html#action19
>      [35] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action03
>      [36] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action04
>      [37] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action09
>      [38] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action11
>      [39] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action12
>      [40] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action13
>      [41] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action14
>      [42] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action15
>
>    [DONE] ACTION: Ben to determine how to highlight RDFa at TPAC
>    [recorded in
>    [43]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/18-rdfa-minutes.html#action17]
>    [DONE] ACTION: Ben to figure out *how* to do the namespace-doc GRDDL
>    thing [recorded in
>    [44]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action18]
>    [DONE] ACTION: Ben to log Danny's issue to tracker. [recorded in
>    [45]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/18-rdfa-minutes.html#action18]
>    [DONE] ACTION: Manu to upload test harness source code to W3C CVS.
>    [recorded in
>    [46]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action07]
>    [DONE] ACTION: Ralph to make [47]http://www.w3.org/2008/07/rdfa-xslt
>    happen [recorded in
>    [48]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action16]
>    [DONE] ACTION: Shane to update XHTML ns document to point to new
>    XSLT URI [recorded in
>    [49]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action17]
>
>      [43] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/18-rdfa-minutes.html#action17
>      [44] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action18
>      [45] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/18-rdfa-minutes.html#action18
>      [46] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action07
>      [47] http://www.w3.org/2008/07/rdfa-xslt
>      [48] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action16
>      [49] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action17
>
>    [DROPPED] ACTION: Jeremy review and consider expanding the
>    description of TopBraid in the RDFa wiki [recorded in
>    [50]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action02]
>
>      [50] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action02
>
>    [End of minutes]
>      _____________________________________________________
>
>
>     Minutes formatted by David Booth's [51]scribe.perl version 1.133
>     ([52]CVS log)
>     $Date: 2008/10/02 17:44:17 $
>
>      [51] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm
>      [52] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/
>
>
Received on Monday, 6 October 2008 11:13:32 GMT

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