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(unknown charset) Re: (unknown charset) ظRe: Patent application o(unknown charset) n converting SPARQL to SQL

From: (unknown charset) ashok malhotra <ashok.malhotra@oracle.com>
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 2009 08:09:35 -0800
Message-ID: <4B27B4BF.5090705@oracle.com>
To: (unknown charset) Li Ma <maliml@sina.com>
CC: (unknown charset) Juan Sequeda <juanfederico@gmail.com>, RDB2RDF WG <public-rdb2rdf-wg@w3.org>
Thank you, Li Ma. Good to hear from you.
Since your papers are in the public domain we can argue that there is 
prior art that has been disclosed in public archives the patent 
application has no merit.

This is a high-level statement. If someone can take a look at the Patent 
Applications
(Juan pointed out there were 2 related applications) and check the 
details, that would be
very helpful.


All the best, Ashok


Li Ma wrote:
>
> I happened to read this patent when I worked for IBM research. Indeed, 
> there is a "sister" patent named "RDF Store Database Design for Faster 
> Triplet Access" by the same inventors. These two patents describe 
> methods to store and query RDF data in relational databases. One 
> patent focuses on storage work and claims a de-normalized schema to 
> store RDF data, and the other one focuses on query work and claims a 
> method to translate SPARQL queries to SQL queries over the 
> de-normalized relational schema. To my understanding, such patents do 
> not affect the WG's work too much.
>
> FYI, IBM China Research (I used to be a staff member of it) has done 
> some work on both RDF store [1,3] and mapping based SPARQL access to 
> relational data [2]. [2] describes a method to support SPARQL queries 
> over relational databases using D2RQ mapping language and with rule 
> inference support. The mapping based SPARQL to SQL query translation 
> is closely combined with rule inference.
>
> I have to say regret for this night's conference call since I will 
> have a meeting early tomorrow morning (my time). Thanks for your 
> understanding.
>
> [1] Effective and efficient semantic web data management over DB2, 
> http://portal.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=1376616.1376735
>
> [2] Semantic Enhancement for Enterprise Data Management, 
> http://data.semanticweb.org/papers/iswc/2009/in-use/paper157.pdf
>
> [3] An Effective SPARQL Support over Relational Databases, 
> http://www.springerlink.com/content/u8217106407787n8/
>
> Best regards,
>
> Li Ma
> ----- ԭʼʼ -----
> ˣJuan Sequeda <juanfederico@gmail.com>
> ռˣashok.malhotra@oracle.com
> ⣺Re: Patent application on converting SPARQL to SQL
> ڣ2009-12-15 21:43:57
>
> As you know, we (UT Austin) have been working with Microsoft, but 
> internally, there is a lot of miscommunication (I guess this may be 
> common in large corporartions).
>
>
> We are working with the lead guy in the SQL Server optimization group. 
> He was not aware of this and I asked him about this patent. He is 
> looking into this./div>
>
> And, if I am not wrong, Microsoft bought Intellidiension [1], so this 
> patent may be coming from them.
>
> I know Eric has already a lot of experience in SPARQL to SQL. We are 
> also writing up a report of the SPARQL to SQL stuff thats in Oracle 
> (our intent is to submit to ESWC2010)./div>
>
> At the moment, the most complete and formal work that I know of is 
> from Chebotko et al. Here is a TR [2] and here is the journal version 
> [3]. Another work is from Cleveland Clinic from their rdf store [4].
>
> I've been going through Chebtoko's stuff. Very complete... too 
> complete IMO. He defines a relational alegbra for sparql and then 
> proves that the sparql alegbra can be translated to the new sparql 
> relational alegbra. In our work, we haven't "complicated" our selves 
> that much. I don't think Eric has either. But this is for another 
> discussion.
>
> Cheers and talk to you all later.
>
>
> [1]a 
> href="http://www.intellidimension.com/">http://www.intellidimension.com/
> [2]a 
> href="http://www.cs.wayne.edu/~artem/main/research/TR-DB-052006-CLJF.pdf">http://www.cs.wayne.edu/~artem/main/research/TR-DB-052006-CLJF.pdf
> [3]a 
> href="http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6TYX-4W32KH3-1&_user=10&_rdoc=1&_fmt=&_orig=search&_sort=d&_docanchor=&view=c&_acct=C000050221&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=10&md5=08d07b63a9c6a905139e0f6634cd76f9">http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6TYX-4W32KH3-1&_user=10&_rdoc=1&_fmt=&_orig=search&_sort=d&_docanchor=&view=c&_acct=C000050221&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=10&md5=08d07b63a9c6a905139e0f6634cd76f9
> [4]a 
> href="http://portal.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=1620437">http://portal.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=1620437
>
> Juan Sequeda, Ph.D Student
> Dept. of Computer Sciences
> The University of Texas at Austin
> www.juansequeda.com <http://www.juansequeda.com/>
> www.semanticwebaustin.org <http://www.semanticwebaustin.org/>
>
>
> On Tue, Dec 15, 2009 at 8:29 AM, ashok malhotra 
> <ashok.malhotra@oracle.com <mailto:ashok.malhotra@oracle.com>> wrote:
>
>     This is a patent application. The patent has not been granted
>     yet. Regardless of what we feel are the chances
>     for its success we should argue against it because, if it is
>     granted, all vendors may end up paying Microsoft to
>     license the technology.
>     What we need are publicly available papers that describe SPARQL to
>     SQL mapping. In the reference from Ivan Herman
>     Jim Hendler says they did some work in this area. Perhaps
>     Virtuoso has something in its product literature that we can cite.
>     There may be other papers that RDB2RDF WG members have published.
>
>     The technique seems to depend on a particular method for storing
>     the triples. I could not figure this out as I did not
>     get the figures with the application. If, of course, the
>     technique works only with a special storage strategy then it does
>     not apply if you store the triples in a different way.
>     All the best, Ashok
>
>
>
>     Michael Hausenblas wrote:
>
>         All,
>
>         Just stumbled upon [1] that there is a pending SPARQL to SQL
>         patent
>         application [2] by Microsoft ... anyone knows more about this?
>
>         Cheers,
>         Michael
>
>         [1] http://twitter.com/ivan_herman/status/6686176991
>         [2] http://www.faqs.org/patents/app/20090138437
>
>         br> 
>
>
>
Received on Tuesday, 15 December 2009 16:13:21 UTC

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