W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > public-prov-wg@w3.org > October 2012

Re: PROV-ISSUE-516: Data Model Section 5.2.1 [prov-dm]

From: Khalid Belhajjame <Khalid.Belhajjame@cs.man.ac.uk>
Date: Wed, 3 Oct 2012 13:18:17 +0100
Message-ID: <CAANah+GgBgACOdBVG_PER-KNo3et3BREyM0PunNw6fCW77yRLg@mail.gmail.com>
To: Luc Moreau <l.moreau@ecs.soton.ac.uk>
Cc: public-prov-wg@w3.org
Hi,

I think that the confusion that the reviewer had stems from the fact
that derivation is defined as "transformation", which one may argue is
an activity.

So, I guess we may need to slightly change the definition of
Derivation. Rather than stating "Derivation is a tranformation",
replacing with something in the lines of "Derivation is used to that
an entity was constructed by updating or ? another entity", would
address the reviewer concerns and avoid confusion.

Thanks, khalid

On 25 September 2012 12:10, Luc Moreau <l.moreau@ecs.soton.ac.uk> wrote:
> Dear all,
>
> I have drafted a response to ISSUE-516 on the wiki at:
> http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/wiki/ResponsesToPublicComments#ISSUE-516_.28DerivationAsBundle.29
> It is copied below for your convenience.
>
> Feedback appreciated.
> Thanks,
> Luc
>
> ISSUE-516 (DerivationAsBundle)
>
> Original email:
> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-prov-wg/2012Sep/0106.html
> Tracker: http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/track/issues/516
> Group Response:
>
> A derivation is not an activity, a derivation is a transformation of an
> entity to another. A derivation may be realized by one or more activities.
> If a derivation (between e2 and e1) is realized by one known activity, then
> that activity generated e2 and used e1.
> All this is formalized in the constraints document (see references).
> The reason why derivation can refer to a usage and a generation is that we
> wanted to be able to express the derivation path in full. This is particular
> important in a number of use cases, including result reproducibility.
> So, derivation is a construct that refers to two entities, an activity
> (similarly to other relations in the model) and in addition to a usage and a
> generation, by means of their identifiers. (Reminder: these identifiers
> identify entity/activity/usage/generation and not statements).
> A bundle is a set of provenance statements. (Reminder: statements do not
> have identifiers.)
> Hence, a derivation is not a bundle, it does not contain statements.
>
> References:
>
> derivation expandable parameters:
> http://www.w3.org/TR/2012/WD-prov-constraints-20120911/#expandable-parameters-fig
> derivation constraint:
> http://www.w3.org/TR/2012/WD-prov-constraints-20120911/#derivation-generation-use-inference_text
>
> Original author's acknowledgement:
>
> [edit]
>
>
>
> On 10/09/2012 09:45, Provenance Working Group Issue Tracker wrote:
>
> PROV-ISSUE-516: Data Model Section 5.2.1   [prov-dm]
>
> http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/track/issues/516
>
> Raised by: Luc Moreau
> On product: prov-dm
>
>
>
> http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/wiki/LC_Feedback#Data_Model_Section_5.2.1
>
> ISSUE-463
>
> See comments for 2.1.2, as well as the text that indicates that a derivation
> is an activity ("underpinning activities performing the necessary actions
> resulting in such a derivation"). However, it seems the intended concept of
> a derivation is a summary of information that describes how the creation of
> one entity was informed by another. If this is correct, is a derivation a
> type of bundle? Or would a bundle contain statement(s) regarding a
> derivation? Please clarify the relationship between these concepts.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Professor Luc Moreau
> Electronics and Computer Science   tel:   +44 23 8059 4487
> University of Southampton          fax:   +44 23 8059 2865
> Southampton SO17 1BJ               email: l.moreau@ecs.soton.ac.uk
> United Kingdom                     http://www.ecs.soton.ac.uk/~lavm
>
Received on Wednesday, 3 October 2012 12:18:51 UTC

This archive was generated by hypermail 2.3.1 : Tuesday, 6 January 2015 21:58:19 UTC