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RE: question on primer example

From: Polleres, Axel <axel.polleres@siemens.com>
Date: Wed, 3 Oct 2012 17:26:37 +0200
To: "rudolph@kit.edu" <rudolph@kit.edu>
CC: "public-owl-comments@w3.org" <public-owl-comments@w3.org>
Message-ID: <9DA51FFE5E84464082D7A089342DEEE80149E378BC5E@ATVIES9917WMSX.ww300.siemens.net>

Hi Sebastian,

> As far as your suggestion to use "all" instead of "some" is
> concerned, this would not convey the intended semantics since
> then all individuals which are *not* in a hasAge relation to
> any value would be classified as teenagers (mind the somewhat
> unintuitive interpretation of the "all").

Why? If you refer to the last example in http://www.w3.org/TR/2009/REC-owl2-primer-20091027/#Advanced_Use_of_Datatypes
"Teenager" is declared as a *subclass* of those with some (or as I suggest 'all') ages between 13 and 19.
In the "all" reading, all I could infer is IMO that someone with an age out of that range would be inferred *not* to be a
Teenager (which I find quite intuitive, but which wouldn't work for the "some" reading), right?
So, I don't really get it (maybe an embarrassing, temporary brain-malfunctioning :-) but happy to learn where my mistake is).

> (mind the somewhat
> unintuitive interpretation of the "all").

Can you elaborate?

(BTW, I am happy to take this discussion to another, more
adequate list, if this is not the right place, as mentioned
earlier, this is not intended as a formal comment to the spec)

Axel

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Sebastian Rudolph [mailto:rudolph@kit.edu]
> Sent: Mittwoch, 03. Oktober 2012 12:01
> To: Polleres, Axel
> Cc: public-owl-comments@w3.org
> Subject: Re: question on primer example
>
> Hi Axel,
>
> it might be better to refer to the current version of the
> primer, i.e. http://www.w3.org/TR/2009/REC-owl2-primer-20091027/
> If you take the mentioned snippet per se, you are right, it
> allows for persons having more than one age. However if you
> also specify the axiom
>
> FunctionalDataProperty( :hasAge )
>
> it defines :hasAge to be functional and hence allows only one
> age per individual. If you assume this axiom, then the
> definition of Teenager via "some" is perfectly fine.
> As far as your suggestion to use "all" instead of "some" is
> concerned, this would not convey the intended semantics since
> then all individuals which are *not* in a hasAge relation to
> any value would be classified as teenagers (mind the somewhat
> unintuitive interpretation of the "all").
>
> Best,
>  Sebastian
>
>
>
>
>
> Am 03.10.2012 um 09:19 schrieb Polleres, Axel:
>
> > Hi,
> >
> > I have some question on the primer example on DataRanges, cf.
> > http://www.w3.org/TR/2008/WD-owl2-primer-20080411/#Adatarange
> >
> > The prose text says
> > "For example, we might have Teenager as those people whose
> age is an integer that is at least 13 but less than 20, Adult
> as those people whose age is at least 21, and Child as those
> people whose age is in the complement of adult ages."
> >
> > Class: Teenager EquivalentClass: Person and hasAge some
> integer[>= 13
> > , < 20]
> > Class: Adult EquivalentClass: Person and hasAge some integer[>= 21]
> > Class: Child EquivalentClass: Person and not ( hasAge some
> integer[>=
> > 21] )
> >
> > As it stands, this seems to allow several ages per person -
> one of which is in the defined range.
> > IMO, it would be more intuitive to use for the first two
> lines "all" instead of "some" here plus stating that age is
> functional (each person has exactly one age, wouldn't it?
> >
> > Not a big deal nor meant as a formal comment, but just to
> note and ask for some opinion from the group or explanation
> why you got to formulate the example like that.
> >
> > With best regards,
> > Axel Polleres
> >
> > Siemens Aktiengesellschaft Oesterreich CT RTC BAM CON-AT
> > Siemensstrasse 90 1210 Vienna, Austria
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> > Mobile: +43 664 88550859
> > mailto:axel.polleres@siemens.com
> >
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>
> _________________________________________________
> PD Dr. Sebastian Rudolph
> senior researcher & project leader at AIFB Karlsruhe
> Institute of Technology (KIT)
> rudolph@kit.edu                    phone +49 721 608 - 47362
> www.sebastian-rudolph.de        fax +49 721 608 - 45998
>
>
Received on Wednesday, 3 October 2012 15:27:16 GMT

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