- From: Paolo Ciccarese <paolo.ciccarese@gmail.com>
- Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2014 15:43:42 -0500
- To: Robert Sanderson <azaroth42@gmail.com>
- Cc: public-openannotation <public-openannotation@w3.org>
- Message-ID: <CAFPX2kC1g8Bxo6_vRbiXKHuY1+fpkLavXsg=Czgy93XOGN+iXg@mail.gmail.com>
On Tue, Jan 21, 2014 at 3:41 PM, Robert Sanderson <azaroth42@gmail.com>wrote:
>
> 1. How about "on"?
> Then the body is a comment on the target, or a tag is a tag on the target.
>
+1
>
> 2. Agreed. Atom uses the term "generator". Twitter uses "source", and only
> has one timestamp, "created_at".
> Previously we've used the terms generator and generatedAt in preference to
> serializedBy/At, which would be one option.
> I would prefer not to use "publisher" as that would be confusing to
> companies that consider themselves digital publishers.
>
Agree, 'publisher' would create confusion. We want to keep it for the
"right' scenario.
>
>
>
> On Tue, Jan 21, 2014 at 12:33 PM, Paolo Ciccarese <
> paolo.ciccarese@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Rob,
>> feedback on these two:
>> 1) oa:hasTarget : about
>> Because of the inversion with Tags and Semantic Tags.
>> I would prefer 'target' or 'on' even if I know it can be confused with a
>> timestamp.
>>
>> 2) oa:serializedBy : client
>> Because I serialize the annotation in OA format mostly from a server.
>> Just to avoid confusion I would change that. Not sure what to though
>> (serializer? publisher?)
>> I would also keep oa:serializedBy and oa:serializedAt aligned
>> terminologically speaking (serializer/serialized or publisher/published).
>>
>> I feel pretty comfortable with all the rest.
>>
>> Best,
>> Paolo
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 21, 2014 at 1:54 PM, Robert Sanderson <azaroth42@gmail.com>wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> To kick this off with a strawman mapping:
>>>
>>>
>>> Annotation:
>>>
>>> oa:hasTarget : about
>>> oa:hasBody : body
>>> oa:motivatedBy : reason
>>> oa:annotatedBy : user
>>> oa:annotatedAt : time
>>> oa:serializedBy : client
>>> oa:serializedAt : published
>>> oa:styledBy : stylesheet
>>> oa:equivalentTo : copyOf
>>>
>>> Resources:
>>>
>>> cnt:chars : content
>>> cnt:bytes : bytes
>>> dc:format : format
>>> dc:language : lang
>>> foaf:page : page
>>> rdfs:label : label
>>>
>>>
>>> Agents:
>>>
>>> foaf:name : name
>>> foaf:mbox : email
>>> foaf:homepage : homepage
>>> foaf:openid : openid
>>> foaf:nick : nick
>>>
>>>
>>> SpecificResources:
>>>
>>> oa:hasSource : full
>>> oa:hasSelector : selector
>>> oa:hasState : state
>>> oa:hasScope : seenIn
>>> oa:styleClass : style
>>> oa:when : when
>>> oa:cachedSource : cachedAt
>>> dct:conformsTo : spec
>>>
>>>
>>> Selectors:
>>>
>>> oa:start : start
>>> oa:end : end
>>> oa:prefix : prefix
>>> oa:suffix : suffix
>>> oa:exact : quote
>>> rdf:value : value
>>>
>>>
>>> Multiplicity:
>>>
>>> NB -- I think we can simplify this part of the spec a lot by JUST using
>>> rdf:Lists. So I present two proposals, one for the current spec and then
>>> for the proposed change.
>>>
>>> 1. Current Spec.
>>>
>>> oa:default : default
>>> oa:item : items
>>> rdf:first : first
>>> rdf:rest : rest
>>>
>>>
>>> 2. Proposal for simplification
>>>
>>> We can make better use of the JSON list construction (and other
>>> serializations) by not having a multi-class object, and instead only ever
>>> using the list as an anonymous object of a predicate, say oa:items. After
>>> the discussion last time, the serialization algorithm for JSON-LD was
>>> updated so our current spec does now work at least without randomly
>>> dropping out information.
>>>
>>> Thus oa:Choice becomes:
>>> { "@type" : "Choice",
>>> "items" : [default, firstOption, secondOption]
>>> }
>>>
>>> And oa:Composite and oa:List collapse to:
>>> { "@type" : "List",
>>> "items" : [first, second, third]
>>> }
>>>
>>>
>>> Classes:
>>>
>>> * We predefine them all without their prefixes, and drop super-class
>>> names (eg oa:FragmentSelector --> Fragment)
>>> * Make a simpler term for SpecificResource of "Segment" -- anyone who
>>> knows the model will understand that they can also use State and Styles
>>> with it, even if it's not a "segment" per se.
>>>
>>> --------
>>>
>>> Thus, the simple example from the spec:
>>>
>>> {
>>> "@context": "http://www.w3.org/ns/oa-context-new.json",
>>> "@type": "Annotation",
>>> "body": "http://www.example.org/body1",
>>> "about": "http://www.example.org/target1"
>>> }
>>>
>>> And the more complex example:
>>>
>>> {
>>> "@context": "http://www.w3.org/ns/oa-context-20130208.json",
>>> "@id": "http://www.example.org/annotations/anno1",
>>> "@type": "Annotation",
>>>
>>> "time": "2012-11-10T09:08:07",
>>> "user": {
>>> "@id": "http://www.example.org/people/person1",
>>> "@type": "Person",
>>> "email": "mailto:person1@example.org",
>>> "name": "Person One"
>>> },
>>>
>>> "reason" : "commenting",
>>> "body": {
>>> "@type": "Text",
>>> "content": "This is part of our logo"
>>> },
>>> "about": {
>>> "@type": "Segment",
>>> "selector": {
>>> "@type": "Fragment",
>>> "value": "xywh=10,10,5,5"
>>> "spec": "http://www.w3.org/TR/media-frags/",
>>> },
>>> "full": {
>>> "@id": "http://www.example.org/images/logo.jpg",
>>> "@type": "Image"
>>> }
>>> }
>>> }
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Thoughts?
>>>
>>> Rob
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jan 21, 2014 at 3:18 AM, Ivan Herman <ivan@w3.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>> @context rules:-)
>>>>
>>>> Ivan
>>>>
>>>> On 20 Jan 2014, at 21:26 , Robert Sanderson <azaroth42@gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> >
>>>> > Doug,
>>>> >
>>>> > My experience is the same. In IIIF [1], we specifically did NOT use
>>>> the OA context mapping and went with something less RDFy and more in line
>>>> with the domain. We went even further than your suggestion, with
>>>> "hasTarget" being just "on". This is one great advantage of JSON-LD, that
>>>> the serialization can be very different from the (abstract) data model
>>>> while still enabling semantic interoperability.
>>>> >
>>>> > I could easily imagine something like:
>>>> >
>>>> > {
>>>> > "@type" : "Annotation",
>>>> > "reason" : "commenting",
>>>> > "body" : "http://example.net/body",
>>>> > "about" : "http://example.org/target"
>>>> > }
>>>> >
>>>> > as being more palatable than the current RDF centric context. Again,
>>>> I think this is something that we can derive some criteria for, redesign,
>>>> solicit feedback and iterate on.
>>>> >
>>>> > Rob
>>>> >
>>>> > 1 --
>>>> http://www.shared-canvas.org/datamodel/iiif/metadata-api.html#Annotation
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > On Mon, Jan 20, 2014 at 12:13 PM, Doug Schepers <schepers@w3.org>
>>>> wrote:
>>>> > Hi, Rob–
>>>> >
>>>> > I couldn't agree more with Randall and Blaine. I was struck by how
>>>> clumsy the predicate-like syntax felt to me; doubtless this is just an
>>>> aesthetic from my background in JS, HTML, CSS, SVG, etc., but I think it's
>>>> how most web developers would react as well.
>>>> >
>>>> > If there's a way to have terms that map from JSON-friendly syntax to
>>>> RDF-friendly syntax, that would be really great (e.g., "hasBody" and "body"
>>>> are quivalent; similarly for "hasTarget" -> "target", "annotatedBy" ->
>>>> "annotator", "annotatedAt" -> "timstamp", and so on).
>>>> >
>>>> > Regards-
>>>> > -Doug
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > On 1/20/14 1:07 PM, Robert Sanderson wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> > Second item from the discussion seems to be the availability of a web
>>>> > developer friendly JSON serialization.
>>>> >
>>>> > Some background -- we have been asked for JSON serializations for at
>>>> > least 3 years. Here is one such request of many, from 2011:
>>>> > https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/oac-discuss/CSq9Jsdd3zkwhere we
>>>> > kicked the can down the road waiting for JSON-LD to come along.
>>>> >
>>>> > Which it has, and is the recommended serialization for Open
>>>> Annotation.
>>>> >
>>>> > So the question is not the JSON serialization's existence, but its
>>>> > developer friendliness, and whether we can do any better while
>>>> remaining
>>>> > conformant with the JSON-LD specification.
>>>> >
>>>> > I think that would be a great discussion to have, or rather to
>>>> restart,
>>>> > as it was brought up in point 2 of this thread:
>>>> >
>>>> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-openannotation/2013Apr/0015.html
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Rob
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ----
>>>> Ivan Herman, W3C
>>>> Digital Publishing Activity Lead
>>>> Home: http://www.w3.org/People/Ivan/
>>>> mobile: +31-641044153
>>>> GPG: 0x343F1A3D
>>>> FOAF: http://www.ivan-herman.net/foaf
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Dr. Paolo Ciccarese
>> http://www.paolociccarese.info/
>> Biomedical Informatics Research & Development
>> Instructor of Neurology at Harvard Medical School
>> Assistant in Neuroscience at Mass General Hospital
>> Member of the MGH Biomedical Informatics Core
>> +1-857-366-1524 (mobile) +1-617-768-8744 (office)
>>
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>>
>
>
--
Dr. Paolo Ciccarese
http://www.paolociccarese.info/
Biomedical Informatics Research & Development
Instructor of Neurology at Harvard Medical School
Assistant in Neuroscience at Mass General Hospital
Member of the MGH Biomedical Informatics Core
+1-857-366-1524 (mobile) +1-617-768-8744 (office)
CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This message is intended only for the addressee(s),
may contain information that is considered
to be sensitive or confidential and may not be forwarded or disclosed to
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If you have received this message in error, please notify the sender
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Received on Tuesday, 21 January 2014 20:44:10 UTC