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Re: best practice RDF in HTML

From: Ivan Herman <ivan@w3.org>
Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2012 11:36:36 +0200
Cc: public-lod <public-lod@w3.org>, semantic-web <semantic-web@w3.org>
Message-Id: <77FC6055-2DA6-46D2-BEC5-B3204A024694@w3.org>
To: Sebastian Hellmann <hellmann@informatik.uni-leipzig.de>

On Jun 13, 2012, at 11:13 , Sebastian Hellmann wrote:

> Ivan,
> thanks for the link. This helps a lot. It is difficult for outsiders to keep track of the progress at W3C, which is why I opened this thread.
> The Turtle language and therefore also the Turtle in HTML <script> will be part of RDF 1.1, right?

Essentially, yes. I am not sure 'part of' is really the correct term here, but Turtle will be standardized by the same group, ie, the RDF Working Group.

> 
> I am asking, because we might make use of this in NIF[1] in the following both ways. (Note that RDFa might also be an option or alternative).
> Both options (especially B) are drafts, so feedback is welcome.
> 
> 
> *****OPTION A (using hash - ids)*****
> <html>
> <head>
> <script>

It should say: <script type="text/turtle">

> @base <...#>
> @prefix str: <http://nlp2rdf.lod2.eu/schema/string/> .
> @prefix itsx: <http://www.w3.org/20XX/XX/its2.0/> .
> <hash_10_6_03925a352b25cb24e02e1dae623d0936_Berlin>
> itsx:mentions <http://dbpedia.org/resource/Berlin> ;
> itsx:entityType <http://nerd.eurecom.fr/ontology#City> .
> </script>
> <body>
> Berlin is the capital of Germany.
> </body>
> 
> 
> *****OPTION B (using id milestones)*****
> <html>
> <head>
> <script>

See above.

Cheers

Ivan


> @base <...#>
> @prefix str: <http://nlp2rdf.lod2.eu/schema/string/> .
> @prefix itsx: <http://www.w3.org/20XX/XX/its2.0/> .
> <id_Berlin_uuid_3488jdndu438>
> itsx:mentions <http://dbpedia.org/resource/Berlin> ;
> itsx:entityType <http://nerd.eurecom.fr/ontology#City> .
> </script>
> <body>
> <span id="id_Berlin_uuid_3488jdndu438">Berlin<span> is the capital of Germany.
> </body>
> 
> 
> All the best,
> Sebastian
> 
> [1] http://svn.aksw.org/papers/2012/WWW_NIF/public/string_ontology.pdf
> 
> On 06/12/2012 06:40 PM, Ivan Herman wrote:
>> Sebastian,
>> 
>> Stéphane Corlosquet has already commented on this, but somehow the thread went on: the upcoming Turtle standard refers to the possibility of adding Turtle into an HTML file using the<script>  element[1]. [1] refers to the editor's draft, but the RDF WG is very close to Last Call.
>> 
>> Some (essentially RDFa) tools already implement that, eg, pyRdfa[2], or (as far as I know) the Ruby based RDF Distiller[3] do it (possibly through a separate option setting).
>> 
>> Does this help?
>> 
>> Ivan
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> [1] http://dvcs.w3.org/hg/rdf/raw-file/default/rdf-turtle/index.html#in-html
>> [2] http://www.w3.org/2012/pyRdfa/
>> [3] http://rdf.greggkellogg.net/distiller
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Jun 12, 2012, at 18:22 , Sebastian Hellmann wrote:
>> 
>>> Dear Mark,
>>> my main concerns are:
>>> 1. What are the best practices to include invisible RDFa in an HTML document. I think Keith answered that. Maybe at the end of the body would be the most unobtrusive way.  The same question was raised here: http://answers.semanticweb.com/questions/10161/is-visually-hidden-rdfa-an-anti-pattern
>>> I just wanted to reassure that hidden RDFa is not contradicting the intention of RDFa.
>>> Are there any practical disadvantages (besides the obvious increase in byte size)?
>>> 
>>> 2. Are there any alternatives to RDFa to include RDF in HTML ?
>>> 
>>> All the best,
>>> Sebastian
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On 06/12/2012 05:52 PM, Mark Birbeck wrote:
>>>> Hi Sebastian,
>>>> 
>>>> It's not clear to me whether you are saying that you don't want to use
>>>> RDFa because:
>>>> 
>>>> * you don't like it, or;
>>>> 
>>>> * you think that it needs to have some user-oriented manifestation.
>>>> 
>>>> There is no requirement that the RDFa in a document is displayed to
>>>> the user in any way, or that the triples somehow 'double-up'. This
>>>> means that your example could also be marked up like this:
>>>> 
>>>>   <div
>>>>     xmlns:cd="http://www.recshop.fake/cd#"
>>>>     about="http://www.recshop.fake/cd/Empire_Burlesque"
>>>>   >
>>>>      <span property="cd:artist" content="Bob Dylan"></span>
>>>>     <span property="cd:dbpedia"
>>>> resource="http://dbpedia.org/resource/Empire_Burlesque"></span>
>>>>   </div>
>>>> 
>>>> Regards,
>>>> 
>>>> Mark
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> On Tue, Jun 12, 2012 at 3:02 PM, Sebastian Hellmann
>>>> <hellmann@informatik.uni-leipzig.de>   wrote:
>>>>> Dear list,
>>>>> What are the best practice to include a set of RDF triples in HTML.
>>>>> *Please note*: I am not looking for the RDFa way to include triples. I just
>>>>> want to add a set of triples somewhere in an HTML document. They are not
>>>>> supposed to show up like "Wikinomics", "Don Tapscott" in  the following
>>>>> example:
>>>>> 
>>>>> <div  xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
>>>>>  about="http://www.example.com/books/wikinomics">
>>>>>  <span  property="dc:title">Wikinomics</span>
>>>>>  <span  property="dc:creator">Don Tapscott</span>
>>>>>  <span  property="dc:date">2006-10-01</span>
>>>>> </div>
>>>>> 
>>>>> I don't want to use the strings in the HTML document as objects in the
>>>>> triples. My use case is that I just have a large set of triples, e.g. 1000
>>>>> that I want to include as a bulk somewhere and ship along with the html.
>>>>> Which way is the best? Do the examples below work?
>>>>> All the best,
>>>>> Sebastian
>>>>> 
>>>>> *******************************************
>>>>> Include in head
>>>>> ******************************************
>>>>> <html>
>>>>> <head>
>>>>> <script type="application/rdf+xml">
>>>>> <rdf:RDF
>>>>> xmlns:rdf="http://www.w3.org/1999/02/22-rdf-syntax-ns#"
>>>>> xmlns:cd="http://www.recshop.fake/cd#">
>>>>> 
>>>>> <rdf:Description
>>>>> rdf:about="http://www.recshop.fake/cd/Empire Burlesque">
>>>>> <cd:artist>Bob Dylan</cd:artist>
>>>>> <cd:dbpedia rdf:resource="http://dbpedia.org/resource/Empire_Burlesque">
>>>>> </rdf:Description>
>>>>> </rdf:RDF>
>>>>> </script>
>>>>> </head>
>>>>> <body>
>>>>> </body>
>>>>> </html>
>>>>> ******************************
>>>>> attach after html
>>>>> *****************************
>>>>> <html>
>>>>> <head>
>>>>> </head>
>>>>> <body>
>>>>> </body>
>>>>> </html>
>>>>> <rdf:RDF
>>>>> xmlns:rdf="http://www.w3.org/1999/02/22-rdf-syntax-ns#"
>>>>> xmlns:cd="http://www.recshop.fake/cd#">
>>>>> 
>>>>> <rdf:Description
>>>>> rdf:about="http://www.recshop.fake/cd/Empire Burlesque">
>>>>> <cd:artist>Bob Dylan</cd:artist>
>>>>> <cd:dbpedia rdf:resource="http://dbpedia.org/resource/Empire_Burlesque">
>>>>> </rdf:Description>
>>>>> </rdf:RDF>
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> --
>>>>> Dipl. Inf. Sebastian Hellmann
>>>>> Department of Computer Science, University of Leipzig
>>>>> Projects: http://nlp2rdf.org , http://dbpedia.org
>>>>> Homepage: http://bis.informatik.uni-leipzig.de/SebastianHellmann
>>>>> Research Group: http://aksw.org
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> Dipl. Inf. Sebastian Hellmann
>>> Department of Computer Science, University of Leipzig
>>> Projects: http://nlp2rdf.org , http://dbpedia.org
>>> Homepage: http://bis.informatik.uni-leipzig.de/SebastianHellmann
>>> Research Group: http://aksw.org
>>> 
>>> 
>> 
>> ----
>> Ivan Herman, W3C Semantic Web Activity Lead
>> Home: http://www.w3.org/People/Ivan/
>> mobile: +31-641044153
>> FOAF: http://www.ivan-herman.net/foaf.rdf
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Dipl. Inf. Sebastian Hellmann
> Department of Computer Science, University of Leipzig
> Projects: http://nlp2rdf.org , http://dbpedia.org
> Homepage: http://bis.informatik.uni-leipzig.de/SebastianHellmann
> Research Group: http://aksw.org
> 


----
Ivan Herman, W3C Semantic Web Activity Lead
Home: http://www.w3.org/People/Ivan/
mobile: +31-641044153
FOAF: http://www.ivan-herman.net/foaf.rdf
Received on Wednesday, 13 June 2012 09:32:19 UTC

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