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Re: numeric web search (Was: URLs instead of URNs)

From: Deborah MacPherson <debmacp@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 26 May 2009 22:03:30 -0400
Message-ID: <48f213f30905261903l6c989acbs75fd3960f466ce14@mail.gmail.com>
To: Kingsley Idehen <kidehen@openlinksw.com>
Cc: Wolfgang Orthuber <orthuber@kfo-zmk.uni-kiel.de>, Dan Brickley <danbri@danbri.org>, semantic-web <semantic-web@w3.org>, Linked Data community <public-lod@w3.org>
Why can't all unique identifiers URIs be in some unique locations URL? Like
an architectural building where many rooms could have almost exactly the
same performance criteria and contents ~ but the only way to tell what is
where is through the drawings rather than through the specifications. IE
there is one spec for bricks but many different kinds of brick may appear on
many locations of the same building. And many other buildings like it.

There appear to be no drawings for the semantic web to measure or place
things to show or know where they go, or what level of quality needs to be
achieved in the various conditions of use.

Why are URL and URI based on text, natural language, and gibberish requiring
translation rather than a map of numeric identities / addresses / locations
based on 2 or more points? Is the LOD cloud a coordinate system? Could it
be? Are the best maps Lumeta <http://www.lumeta.com/research/> and
UMBEL<http://www.umbel.org/>/
OpenCyc <http://www.cyc.com/cyc/opencyc/overview>? Even if you disagree with
these systems or metrics, how can Maps of Science
<http://mapofscience.com/>dial into any coordinate system?

Are you trying to measure, or point to, feature vectors through numeric
coordinates in lieu of text description? If so, couldn't the LOD cloud be
used as a basemap to measure, depict, and track uniqueness over time
regardless of URL or URI status?

Sincerely,

Deborah MacPherson


Deborah L. MacPherson
Specifications and Research Cannon Design
NBIMS, buildingSMART alliance
Projects Director, Accuracy&Aesthetics

On Tue, May 26, 2009 at 11:57 AM, Kingsley Idehen <kidehen@openlinksw.com>wrote:

> Wolfgang Orthuber wrote:
>
>> We know that a URL refers to a (unique) web address. If also
>> A URL is a Web Address based Identifier
>> then the Web Address determines also the URL. Because the Web address is
>> globally unique, the URL is unique
>> and can be used as unique identifier.
>> Is this correct?
>>
> The URL can be used as an Identifier because you can use a globally unique
> Resource Location/Address as a Name for a Thing (e.g. a Document), albeit
> with implications (i.e. mobility of the Thing you name).
>
>> (then I could write that the pattern name in
>> http://www.orthuber.com/wp1.pdf is a URL, because it is based on
>> the location of a unique "linking file" which points to all defining
>> information)
>>
> <http://www.orthuber.com/wp1.pdf> is the Web Address constrained URI (nee.
> URL) for the resource: wp1.pdf exposed to the Web via an HTTP server.  I've
> made no mention of "all defining information" .
>
>
> Kingsley
>
>>
>> Wolfgang
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kingsley Idehen" <
>> kidehen@openlinksw.com>
>> To: "Wolfgang Orthuber" <orthuber@kfo-zmk.uni-kiel.de>
>> Cc: "Dan Brickley" <danbri@danbri.org>; "semantic-web" <
>> semantic-web@w3.org>; "Linked Data community"
>> <public-lod@w3.org>
>> Sent: Tuesday, May 26, 2009 3:04 PM
>> Subject: Re: numeric web search (Was: URLs instead of URNs)
>>
>>
>>  Wolfgang Orthuber wrote:
>>>
>>>> Dan,
>>>>
>>>> can a http URI refer transiently or accidentally to some address?
>>>>
>>> Of course.
>>>
>>>> Which term do you suggest for something which permanently refers to a
>>>> (unique, permanent) web address, and
>>>> which differs if and only if the web address differs?
>>>>
>>> A URI that carries location/address specificity or dependency
>>> (transiently or accidentally).
>>>
>>> An Identifier with endowed location specificity (overtly or covertly)
>>> isn't optimal, but that doesn't stop
>>> it being an identifier.
>>>
>>> A URL is a Web Address based Identifier -- a URI :-)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Kingsley
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Wolfgang
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dan Brickley" <danbri@danbri.org>
>>>> To: "Wolfgang Orthuber" <orthuber@kfo-zmk.uni-kiel.de>
>>>> Cc: "semantic-web" <semantic-web@w3.org>; "Linked Data community" <
>>>> public-lod@w3.org>
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, May 26, 2009 1:31 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: numeric web search (Was: URLs instead of URNs)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>  On 26/5/09 15:17, Wolfgang Orthuber wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Dan,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> in http://www.w3.org/TR/uri-clarification/ I read "An http URI is a
>>>>>> URL"
>>>>>> . So I concluded that a different http URI is a different URL
>>>>>> (address).
>>>>>> At this I assumed, that all http URIs which refer to the same address
>>>>>> (case insensitive), are defined as "identical". Is this correct?
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I'd rather they'd have said "URL" is a technically obsolete but common
>>>>> colloquial term for http and
>>>>> http-like URIs. Identity of identifiers is tricky because you have to
>>>>> try to distinguish between
>>>>> identifiers which accidentally of transiently refer to the same thing,
>>>>> versus those where it is built-in
>>>>> to the definition of the scheme (eg. the port 80 and domain name
>>>>> canonicalisation rules).
>>>>>
>>>>> Dan
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> Kingsley Idehen       Weblog: http://www.openlinksw.com/blog/~kidehen<http://www.openlinksw.com/blog/%7Ekidehen>
>>> President & CEO OpenLink Software     Web: http://www.openlinksw.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
> --
>
>
> Regards,
>
> Kingsley Idehen       Weblog: http://www.openlinksw.com/blog/~kidehen<http://www.openlinksw.com/blog/%7Ekidehen>
> President & CEO OpenLink Software     Web: http://www.openlinksw.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
Received on Wednesday, 27 May 2009 02:04:04 UTC

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