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Re: [public-i18n-its] <none>

From: Felix Sasaki <fsasaki@w3.org>
Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2008 08:35:27 +0900
Message-ID: <47A109BF.7070701@w3.org>
To: Sjoerd Mullender <sjoerd@acm.org>
CC: Samuel Cruz-Lara <Samuel.Cruz-Lara@loria.fr>, public-i18n-its@w3.org, SYMM Group <symm@w3.org>

Hi Sjoerd,

Sjoerd Mullender wrote:
> Hi Felix,
>
> I am currently working on the SMIL 3.0 DTD and am trying to include 
> your suggestion.  I have a question.  What is the purpose of the ITSNS 
> entity?

for the DTD version of ITS (not XML Schema or RELAX NG), we created that 
entity to allow for the usage of the "xmlns:its" attribute or the 
"xmlns" attribute, the latter in case of ITS used as the default namespace.

> I don't really see how that can be used in a SMIL context since it 
> defines a default namespace which would override the SMIL default 
> namespace.

you are right, that was an oversight by me. You might change

<!ENTITY % ITSNS 'xmlns CDATA "http://www.w3.org/2005/11/its"
xmlns:its CDATA "http://www.w3.org/2005/11/its" '>

to

<!ENTITY % ITSNS ' xmlns:its CDATA "http://www.w3.org/2005/11/its" '>


>
> Also, was it your intention to have an attribute xmlns:its on the 
> <smil> element with a default (or fixed) value of the ITS 
> namespace?How else is one supposed to use the its-prefixed attributes?

I did not think about where to put the xmlns:its attribute, but you are 
right, it should be at the <smil> element so that people can use 
its-prefixed attributes.

Felix

>
> On 2007-09-26 14:01, Felix Sasaki wrote:
>>
>> Hello Samuel,
>>
>> thank you for your reply to the list. Some comments (known to you, 
>> but not to others yet) below.
>>
>> Samuel Cruz-Lara wrote:
>>> Dear Felix,
>>>
>>> We have just discussed about the comment you sent to SYMM WG last 
>>> week in Amsterdam. (LC 1827)
>>>
>>> We agree on your general proposal. So, now we should try to adapt 
>>> the existing
>>> ITS markup declarations to our specific needs.
>>
>> for the proposals 1) and 2), you don't need to adapt anything. You 
>> just need to provide the <its:rules> file which I mentioned at 
>> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-i18n-its/2007JulSep/0064.html 
>> .
>> I'm repeating the proposals for convenience here:
>>
>> 1) an ITS "Translate" rule [3] to separate translatable and
>> non-translatable content,
>> 2) an ITS "Elements Within Text" rule [4] to describe the flow
>> characteristics of elements, and
>> 3) an SMIL 3.0 schema which contains ITS 1.0 markup declarations for 1)
>> and 2).
>>
>>>
>>> As my knowledge about ITS is not good enough, I need to work with 
>>> you all in
>>> order to analyse the way that ITS may help us.
>>>
>>> Of course the general idea is that SMIL 3.0 provides a schema which 
>>> contains
>>> the ITS markup declarations. 
>>
>> again, not necessarily: That was only part 3) or our proposal.
>>
>> How does the SYMM Group think about the proposals 1) and 2)?
>>
>>> However, we have to ensure that this will not
>>> provoke any "trouble" on the SMIL specification nor on the on the 
>>> implementation
>>> side (i.e. on the SMIL players side).
>>
>> Of course. Note that we do not propose a normative change to the SMIL 
>> 3.0 schema, but rather a non-normative adaptation of the schema in a 
>> separate appendix. This is to make SMIL users aware of the 
>> functionality provided by ITS, without breaking their implementations.
>>
>>>
>>> As you have said in your email: "These markup declarations allow for
>>> specifying a lot of more information related to internationalization 
>>> and
>>> localization, like localization notes or terminology information".
>>>
>>> So, I think that a good way to progress should be to work on the 
>>> basis of
>>> several use cases allowing us to understand how ITS may help.
>>
>> I tried to describe use cases for proposals 1) and 2) in my first 
>> mail, so it would be great to get your feedback on these. About 3), 
>> and a proposal to integrate ITS markup declarations into the SMIL 3.0 
>> DTD, see below.
>>
>> In the SMIL 3.0 DTD (yet to be updated, I checked 
>> http://www.w3.org/TR/2007/WD-SMIL3-20070713/smil-DTD.html#smil-attribs-1 
>> ), you have the following entity:
>>
>> <!ENTITY % I18n.extra.attrib "" >
>> <!ENTITY % I18n.attrib "
>>  xml:lang %LanguageCode.datatype; #IMPLIED
>>  %I18n.extra.attrib;"
>>  >
>>
>> I would propose to change I18n.extra.attrib to
>>
>> [[
>> <!ENTITY % I18n.extra.attrib "%ITS-LOCAL-ATTR;" >
>> <!-- ITS-LOCAL-ATTR contains attribute declarations for 
>> internationalization and localization related markup. See 
>> http://www.w3.org/TR/2007/REC-its-20070403/ for more information. -->
>> ]]
>>
>> ITS-LOCAL-ATTR is a modification of the entity 
>> att.local.with-ns.attributes, which is taken from the exemplary ITS DTD
>> http://www.w3.org/TR/2007/REC-its-20070403/its.dtd
>> The DTD fragment below, which I modified for SMIL 3.0 purposes, 
>> contains in comments also explanations of the functionality of the 
>> ITS markup markup. I would think that these explanations are enough 
>> information for a use case description?
>>
>> [[
>> <!-- Entity for the definition of the ITS namespace, necessary for 
>> DTD processing -->
>> <!ENTITY % ITSNS 'xmlns CDATA "http://www.w3.org/2005/11/its"
>> xmlns:its CDATA "http://www.w3.org/2005/11/its" '>
>>
>> <!-- Prefix commonly used for ITS markup -->
>> <!ENTITY % ITSPR 'its:' >
>>
>> <!-- Entity which contains local ITS markup for internationalization 
>> and localization purposes. Explanatations:
>> - its:translate : Attribute to express translation information. See 
>> http://www.w3.org/TR/2007/REC-its-20070403/#trans-datacat .
>> - its:locNote : Attribute for localization notes. See 
>> http://www.w3.org/TR/2007/REC-its-20070403/#locNote-datacat .
>> - its:locNoteType: Attribute for the localization note type 
>> (description or alert). See 
>> http://www.w3.org/TR/2007/REC-its-20070403/#locNote-datacat .
>> - its:term : Attribute to specify terms. See 
>> http://www.w3.org/TR/2007/REC-its-20070403/#terminology .
>> - its:termInfoRef : Attribute to provide references to additional 
>> information about a term. See 
>> http://www.w3.org/TR/2007/REC-its-20070403/#terminology .
>> - its:dir : Attribute to supply information about text 
>> directionality. See 
>> http://www.w3.org/TR/2007/REC-its-20070403/#directionality .
>> -->
>> <!ENTITY % ITS-LOCAL-ATTR '
>> %ITSPR;translate (yes|no) #IMPLIED
>> %ITSPR;locNote CDATA #IMPLIED
>> %ITSPR;locNoteType (alert|description) #IMPLIED
>> %ITSPR;locNoteRef CDATA #IMPLIED
>> %ITSPR;termInfoRef CDATA #IMPLIED
>> %ITSPR;term (yes|no) #IMPLIED
>> %ITSPR;dir (ltr|rtl|lro|rlo) #IMPLIED'>
>> ]]
>>
>> Hope that helps,
>>
>> Felix
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Received on Wednesday, 30 January 2008 23:36:02 UTC

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