[1]W3C [1] http://www.w3.org/ I18N ITS WG 14 Sep 2005 [2]Agenda [2] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-i18n-its/2005JulSep/0055.html See also: [3]IRC log [3] http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-irc Attendees Present Diane, Felix, Goutam, Richard, Tim, Yves Regrets Andrzej, Christian, Karunesh, Sebastian Chair Yves Scribe Felix Contents * [4]Topics 1. [5]Review Action Items From Last Meeting 2. [6]Action items for the f2f 3. [7]f2t meeting during the technical plenary week feb - march 2006 4. [8]Requirements 5. [9]New business * [10]Summary of Action Items _________________________________________________________________ Review Action Items From Last Meeting ACTION: RI to contact person from W3C about feedback from non-wg members. (ONGOING) [recorded in [11]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action01] ACTION: FS to contact person for ATOM (PENDING) [recorded in [12]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action02] ACTION: CL and others to make research on data categories definitions (PENDING) [recorded in [13]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action03] ACTION: RI to post an email to the Activity about the definition of "internationalization" and "localization" (DONE) [recorded in [14]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action04] ri: will be sent today ACTION: CL to add a paragraph on the role of xml:lang to the summary section of the Language Identification requirement. (PENDING) [recorded in [15]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action05] <[16]http://esw.w3.org/topic/its0503ReqLangLocale> [16] http://esw.w3.org/topic/its0503ReqLangLocale%3E [17]http://esw.w3.org/topic/its0503ReqLangLocale?action=diff&rev2=17&r ev1=16 [17] http://esw.w3.org/topic/its0503ReqLangLocale?action=diff&rev2=17&rev1=16 ACTION: FS to add a paragraph somewhere to the role of values of xml:lang in the Language Identification requirement. (DONE) [recorded in [18]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action06] ACTION: FS to add a reference to RFC 3066 bis to the Language Identification requirement (DONE) [recorded in [19]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action07] ACTION: FS to add an additional paragraph to the mapping requirement (DONE) [recorded in [20]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action08] [21]http://esw.w3.org/topic/its0504ReqPurposeSpecMap [21] http://esw.w3.org/topic/its0504ReqPurposeSpecMap [22]http://esw.w3.org/topic/its0504ReqPurposeSpecMap?action=diff&rev2= 15&rev1=13 [22] http://esw.w3.org/topic/its0504ReqPurposeSpecMap?action=diff&rev2=15&rev1=13 ACTION: TF to change the CDATA requirement (DONE) [recorded in [23]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action09] [24]http://esw.w3.org/topic/its0503ReqCDATA [24] http://esw.w3.org/topic/its0503ReqCDATA Tim: explains the changes Felix: looks good [25]http://esw.w3.org/topic/its0504ReqCulturalAspects [25] http://esw.w3.org/topic/its0504ReqCulturalAspects ACTION: YS to add example based on Goutam input to the "Content Style" requirement (DONE) [recorded in [26]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action10] Yves: also made some corrections recently. One comment from CL is not addressed yet. ACTION: YS to create wiki page for POS/related info requirement (DONE) [recorded in [27]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action11] [28]http://esw.w3.org/topic/its0908LinguisticMarkup [28] http://esw.w3.org/topic/its0908LinguisticMarkup Yves: feel free to comment on the wiki Tim: I don't know ... the idea of linguistic markup seems to mean a lot of additional work ... I think you cannot convince content authors to put this information in ... of course it is useful for machine translation or terminology work ... so it is useful, but maybe not useful for us Yves: yes ... maybe it is useful for the future ... there are many things that are specialized felix: for the future, it might be useful Tim: sure ... it is just more that we can do ... it might be other engineering Richard: Maybe we can ask Goutam to spread the idea around and find other people who are interested in the solution ... it is not part of what we think about in the first phase of the ITS Working Group ... we need to ground ITS in a general requirement ... we should transcope the need first, maybe for a later project Felix: Same opinion as Richard ACTION: YS to edit its prefixes in "Limited impact" requirement example (DONE) [recorded in [29]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action12] [30]http://esw.w3.org/topic/its0505LimitImpact [30] http://esw.w3.org/topic/its0505LimitImpact Yves: any comments? Every markup that ITS is adding is towards translation aids only. So, linguistic markup will be helpful for the translation process as well as for translation memory Tim: looks fine to me Action items for the f2f Yves: Please think about co-editing one of the documents ... please work on the reading list ... Two action items for Yves and Felix ... to prepare "ruby" and "indicator of translatability" on participants: [31]http://www.w3.org/International/its/ftf-200509-Sophia.html#Partici pants [31] http://www.w3.org/International/its/ftf-200509-Sophia.html#Participants Richard: will hire a car [32]http://www.w3.org/International/its/ftf-200509-Sophia.html [32] http://www.w3.org/International/its/ftf-200509-Sophia.html ACTION: Richard to hire a car for the f2f [recorded in [33]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action13] Richard: I'll arrive on Sunday and I'll leave on Thursday ... does that cause any problems? No problems Yves: other questions? An additional page: [34]http://www.w3.org/2005/08/i18n-its-f2f-logistics.html [34] http://www.w3.org/2005/08/i18n-its-f2f-logistics.html f2t meeting during the technical plenary week feb - march 2006 Yves: we need to know if we will have a f2f during that week, and which wg we want to meet ... we meeting will be in mandelieu, quite close to ERCIM Richard: Are we planning to have a f2f? ... technical plenary gets lots of wg together ... you get to meet other people and get them into your meeting Yves: second question is: how many people would make it to that meeting? ... timewise that time would be nice Tim: might be able to make it Yves: not sure if I can make that meeting ... Diane, how about you? Diane: I don't know either Yves: We should try to go for it Richard: important would be people you cannot meet easily ... e.g. the xml core people ACTION: Yves to sent a mail to ask people whether they would come to a f2f meeting during the technical plenary week feb - march 2006 [recorded in [35]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action14] ACTION: Felix to think about WGs which ITS might want to meet during the technical plenary [recorded in [36]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action15] Richard: We should not reserve something if we are not sure Requirements [37]http://esw.w3.org/topic/its0505ReqAttrAndTrans [37] http://esw.w3.org/topic/its0505ReqAttrAndTrans Yves: Fixing typos, changing the summary Richard: In the first WD, we did not have a link to the document Yves and I wrote Felix: That link must be in the WD Yves: In the cases there you have s.t. in an attribute, should we come up with a solution? Tim: We can make a recommendation Richard and Felix: discussion on attributes and translatable text. Yves: To me it looks complete, next time we should look at it. Tim: As a requirement it is fine. Felix: For me as well. [38]http://esw.w3.org/topic/its0505ReqNamingScheme#preview [38] http://esw.w3.org/topic/its0505ReqNamingScheme#preview Yves: XForm example from the xform wg would be good ... they had some example for localization Tim: This would only apply to well formed xml, or would the dtd have some different messages? Yves: No, it would be just the document, without the schema ... maybe we should mention that Tim: currently it is phrased that every dtd should follow a predictable naming pattern ACTION: Tim to work on the naming pattern req [recorded in [39]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action16] Richard: the example with buttons ... xforms tries to go away from the "look" of the user interface ... e.g. "selector" might be better than "button" Yves: good point [40]http://esw.w3.org/topic/its0505ReqWhiteSpaces [40] http://esw.w3.org/topic/its0505ReqWhiteSpaces Richard: how about the bidi and the ruby one? Yves: We discussed it when you were not here, and we thought it was good ... we solution will be difficult Tim: Maybe we should move the potential solution to the note section ... so that people are sure that the req document does not contain solutions ACTION: Yves to move some of the text in the note an reword the req on whitespace [recorded in [41]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action17] Ri: there is an xml:space attribute ... we say that css should be used for handling whitespace Yves: so that would happen only at rendering time ... so it does not solve localization issues ... the problem is that you get different types of formatting ... you get problem as you leverage that Ri: the problem are the cases there the carriage returns is significant Yves: the tools have to know when to normalize and when not ... in (x)html, it is clear Ri: defining it at the schema level would be a solution, right? ... so a requirement is to define one or more elements which are able to preserve / not preserve space Yves: we don't have a way that one should not collaps something Ri: talks about XHTML 2 approach Discussion about the whitespace problems New business No new business Yves: see you at the f2f Summary of Action Items [NEW] ACTION: Felix to think about WGs which ITS might want to meet during the technical plenary [recorded in [42]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action15] [NEW] ACTION: Richard to hire a car for the f2f [recorded in [43]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action13] [NEW] ACTION: Tim to work on the naming pattern req [recorded in [44]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action16] [NEW] ACTION: Yves to move some of the text in the note an reword the req on whitespace [recorded in [45]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action17] [NEW] ACTION: Yves to sent a mail to ask people whether they would come to a f2f meeting during the technical plenary week feb - march 2006 [recorded in [46]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action14] [PENDING] ACTION: CL to add a paragraph on the role of xml:lang to the summary section of the Language Identification requirement. [recorded in [47]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action05] [PENDING] ACTION: CL and others to make research on data categories definitions [recorded in [48]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action03] [PENDING] ACTION: FS to contact person for ATOM [recorded in [49]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action02] [PENDING] ACTION: RI to contact person from W3C about feedback from non-wg members. [recorded in [50]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action01] [DONE] ACTION: FS to add a paragraph somewhere to the role of values of xml:lang in the Language Identification requirement. [recorded in [51]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action06] [DONE] ACTION: FS to add a reference to RFC 3066 bis to the Language Identification requirement [recorded in [52]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action07] [DONE] ACTION: FS to add an additional paragraph to the mapping requirement [recorded in [53]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action08] [DONE] ACTION: RI to post an email to the Activity about the definition of "internationalization" and "localization" [recorded in [54]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action04] [DONE] ACTION: TF to change the CDATA requirement [recorded in [55]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action09] [DONE] ACTION: YS to add example based on Goutam input to the "Content Style" requirement [recorded in [56]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action10] [DONE] ACTION: YS to create wiki page for POS/related info requirement [recorded in [57]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action11] [DONE] ACTION: YS to edit its prefixes in "Limited impact" requirement example [recorded in [58]http://www.w3.org/2005/09/14-i18n-minutes.html#action12] [End of minutes] _________________________________________________________________ Minutes formatted by David Booth's [59]scribe.perl version 1.127 ([60]CVS log) $Date: 2005/09/16 00:12:18 $ [59] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm [60] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/