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Re: [html-bidi] Any bidi requirements for MathML (or MathMl in HTML)?

From: Mohamed Mohie <MOHIEM@eg.ibm.com>
Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2010 13:52:26 +0300
To: Ehsan Akhgari <ehsan@mozilla.com>
Cc: "Phillips, Addison" <addison@lab126.com>, "Aharon (Vladimir) Lanin" <aharon@google.com>, Bert Bos <bert@w3.org>, "public-i18n-bidi@w3.org" <public-i18n-bidi@w3.org>, public-i18n-bidi-request@w3.org
Message-ID: <OF57633B5A.C980B0A3-ONC2257783.003A9ABF-C2257783.003BBBB3@eg.ibm.com>
As a native Arabic speaker I confirm that math formulas in Arabic are
written from right-to-left and not from left-to-right with the Arabic
scripts used as symbols in writing formulas.
A simple circle formula like:
x2+y2=r2

is written in Arabic as in the attached image with complete right-to-left
directionality.
                                               (Embedded image moved to
file: pic62326.gif)
where :
x is replaced by 
y is replaced by 
r is replaced by 
2 is replaced by Arabic-indic digit 2

Thanks And Best regards,
Mohamed Mohie , PMP
________________________________________________
GCoC BIDI ,
Advisory Software Engineer, Project Manager, M.Sc.
IBM Egypt-Pyramids Heights Office Park, Building C10
Cairo - Alexandria Desert Road, KM 22.
Giza - Egypt
email : mohiem@eg.ibm.com





From:       Ehsan Akhgari <ehsan@mozilla.com>
To:         "Aharon (Vladimir) Lanin" <aharon@google.com>
Cc:         "Phillips, Addison" <addison@lab126.com>, Bert Bos
            <bert@w3.org>, "public-i18n-bidi@w3.org"
            <public-i18n-bidi@w3.org>
Date:       18/08/2010 01:06 
Subject:    Re: [html-bidi] Any bidi requirements for MathML (or MathMl in
            HTML)?
Sent by:    public-i18n-bidi-request@w3.org



The situation is exactly the same for Persian: math formulas are
written from left-to-right.  I suspect that the same is true for
Arabic as well, but I'll defer the final confirmation to a native
speaker.

--
Ehsan
<http://ehsanakhgari.org/>



On Tue, Aug 17, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Aharon (Vladimir) Lanin
<aharon@google.com> wrote:
> Traditionally, formulas in Hebrew mathematical publications are always
> written left-to-right. The Israel Standards Institute is in the midst of
> considering the question of whether to break with his tradition. Although
a
> final decision has not yet been made, it looks like the answer will
> basically be no: math will continue to be written left-to-right.
>
> For Arabic, on the other hand, the answer may be quite different, but I
know
> little about it.
>
> Aharon
>
> On Tue, Aug 17, 2010 at 5:52 PM, Phillips, Addison <addison@lab126.com>
> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Bert,
>>
>> Thanks for the note. I have added this to our WG agenda for this week.
>>
>> Addison
>>
>> Addison Phillips
>> Globalization Architect (Lab126)
>> Chair (W3C I18N, IETF IRI WGs)
>>
>> Internationalization is not a feature.
>> It is an architecture.
>>
>>
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> > From: public-i18n-bidi-request@w3.org [mailto:public-i18n-bidi-
>> > request@w3.org] On Behalf Of Bert Bos
>> > Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2010 6:33 AM
>> > To: public-i18n-bidi@w3.org
>> > Subject: [html-bidi] Any bidi requirements for MathML (or MathMl in
>> > HTML)?
>> >
>> > This is a somewhat vague question, and also rather late, given that
>> > MathML3 is as good as finished (it's a Proposed Recommendation),
>> > but I
>> > just wondered if anybody has thought about math...
>> >
>> > The html-bidi[1] draft talks about requirements on HTML and CSS. It
>> > doesn't mention MathML, although the current MathML also has bidi
>> > support. And in the current plans for HTML5, MathML will be an
>> > integral
>> > part of the HTML language.
>> >
>> > Are there no additional requirements on MathML?
>> >
>> >
>> > The problem of bidi isolation at least doesn't seem to occur in
>> > MathML:
>> >
>> > Section 3.1.5[2] of MathML3 describes the bidi features of MathML.
>> > It is
>> > possible to set the overall direction of a formula as well as the
>> > base
>> > direction of individual tokens.
>> >
>> > Changing the overall direction acts almost like a mirror, e.g., "a
>> > + b"
>> > is written as "b + a" and superscripts (a) are written on the left
>> > of
>> > their base (a).
>> >
>> > Tokens are symbols (+, =), numbers (12, 0.5), letters (x, y), words
>> > (sin, cos), or phrases ("such that," "theorem 1"). Setting a
>> > direction
>> > on tokens should rarely be needed, the inherited direction and the
>> > Unicode bidi algorithm are usually enough.
>> >
>> > Unlike in HTML, each token is "directionally isolated" (in the
>> > terms of
>> > html-bidi WD), so a BDI attribute is not needed.
>> >
>> >
>> > [1] http://www.w3.org/TR/2010/WD-html-bidi-20100304/

>> > [2] http://www.w3.org/TR/MathML3/chapter3.html#presm.bidi

>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Bert
>> > --
>> >  Bert Bos                ( W 3 C )
>> > http://www.w3.org/

>> >  http://www.w3.org/people/bos

>> > W3C/ERCIM
>> >  bert@w3.org               2004 Rt des Lucioles / BP
>> > 93
>> >  +33 (0)4 92 38 76 92      06902 Sophia Antipolis Cedex,
>> > France
>>
>
>




pic62326.gif
(image/gif attachment: pic62326.gif)

Received on Wednesday, 18 August 2010 20:32:25 GMT

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