Re: 4.13.1 Bread crumb navigation - use of right angle brackets

thanks adrian!

>I also added this to the bug itself, copying it here. Still unsure of the
correct process…

Its useful to add to bug if you have specific comments suggestions.

--

Regards

SteveF
HTML 5.1 <http://www.w3.org/html/wg/drafts/html/master/>


On 17 September 2013 14:23, Adrian Roselli <Roselli@algonquinstudios.com>wrote:

> I also added this to the bug itself, copying it here. Still unsure of the
> correct process…
>
>
> Is it worth noting that, while an ordered list denotes a priority (which I
> think is the best fit), a nested list would be more appropriate?
>
> Here's my thought: The list doesn't show hierarchy, it's just a list. A
> nested list can show the structure as well:
>
> <ol>
>  <li>Home
>   <ol>
>    <li>About
>     <ol>
>      <li>Partners</li>
>     </ol>
>    </li>
>   </ol>
>  </li>
> </ol>
>
> It would render, without CSS, as:
>
> 1. Home
>   1.1. About
>     1.1.1. Partners
>
> I know it's a bunch of "number 1s," but it denotes structure that a
> standard numbered list cannot do.
>
> I suspect it will also be too complex for the average web dev to tackle
> without a pre-built tool to handle it for them (something in a CMS, for
> example).
>
>
> > From: Andrew Herrington [mailto:a.d.herrington@gmail.com]
> > Sent: Tuesday, September 17, 2013 8:46 AM
> >
> > I think an ol is the correct element for a breadcrumb
> > navigation as it denotes a meaningful order:
> >
> > "The ol element represents a list of items, where the items
> > have been intentionally ordered, such that changing the
> > order would change the meaning of the document."[1]
> >
> > [1]http://www.w3.org/html/wg/drafts/html/master/grouping-
> > content.html#the-ol-element
> >
> >
> > On 17 Sep 2013, at 13:29, "Jukka K. Korpela"
> > <jukka.k.korpela@kolumbus.fi>  wrote:
> >
> >
> > 2013-09-17 12:13, Steve Faulkner wrote:
> >
> > I have updated the advice on marking up breadcrumb
> > navigation:
> > http://www.w3.org/html/wg/drafts/html/master/common-
> > idioms.html#rel-up
> >
> > The use of <ol>  markup for anything that might be seen as an
> > ordered list deviates from common practice for no good
> > reason. It implies a default rendering that is practically
> > never the desired one. So why take the trouble of using
> > specific markup when its real effects are definitely not
> > what you want.
> >
> > Even if you think that <ol>  is a possibility here, would it
> > really be something to be recommended in favor of other
> > alternatives?
> >
> >
> >
> > On 26 January 2013 17:00, Steve Faulkner
> > <faulkner.steve@gmail.com <mailto:faulkner.steve@gmail.com> >
> > wrote:
> >
> >    Section 4.13.1 Bread crumb navigation (under Common
> > idioms without
> >    dedicated elements [1])
> >
> >     encourages the use of the right angle bracket to
> > indicate a
> >    breadcrumb navigation trail:
> >
> > It is GREATER THAN sign, and I agree that it is not
> > adequate. But it has become common enough to become
> > tolerable practice. A better character is a real arrow, "?".
> >
> >
> >
> >    The use of >  in this context does not appear to be a good
> > practice to
> >    promote as the angle bracket is a symbol that depending
> > on user agent
> >    (AT in this case) is typically announced as "greater" or
> > not announced
> >    in this context. Either way it is not clearly convyed
> > that its a
> >    breadcrumb trail.
> > Using <ol>  would not express the idea of breadcrumb trail
> > either. It suggests a numbered list of items, typically used
> > when there is a reason to use explicit numbering.
> >
> > "Bread crumb trail" is a concept specific to web pages and
> > similar digital presentations, so there is no traditional
> > way to present it, visually or in speech. Digital media
> > creates its own traditions, in time. Even the "> " notation
> > is not as odd as it may sound. People get used to things
> > that they see or hear often. Visually, too, the use of "> "
> > is a matter of convention: it is a mathematical comparison
> > operator gone wild, and as such "Main >  Products" is
> > illogical visually, too: it does not say that Main is
> > greater than Products.
> >
> > If there is something to be fixed in 4.13.2 in HTML5 CR,
> > it's the use of <p>  instead of <div> . It is pseudosemantic,
> > since this is not about paragraphs in any normal sense -
> > except as blocks of text. And <div>  is a pure block element,
> > which has no default margins, so it is more adequate here.
> > Alternatively, a <ul>  element with two <li>  elements, each
> > containing one bread crumb, could be used.
> >
> > --
> > Yucca, http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/
> >
> >
>
>