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Re: Review of ISSUE-164 change proposals - Part 1: Replace hgroup with the subline element

From: Steve Faulkner <faulkner.steve@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 25 Jul 2012 14:28:31 +0100
Message-ID: <CA+ri+V=K5NxPmrLQSSS48FZzhgWXzf4nn8jCEOTSEEPTa_JWvw@mail.gmail.com>
To: Paul Cotton <Paul.Cotton@microsoft.com>
Cc: "public-html@w3.org" <public-html@w3.org>
Hi Paul ,

> Please let the Chairs know by Tue Jul 31 if you plan to revise your change
> proposal and when you can do the revision by.

 I will make the changes by a week tomorrow.

regards
steveF

On 24 July 2012 19:57, Paul Cotton <Paul.Cotton@microsoft.com> wrote:
> We have five change proposals for ISSUE-164:
>
> http://dev.w3.org/html5/status/issue-status.html#ISSUE-164
>
>
>
> The following is a Chairs review of the following change proposal:
>
>
>
> Replace hgroup with the subline element
>
> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/wiki/ChangeProposals/hgroup
>
>
>
> 1. Structure of change proposal
>
>
>
> The proposal includes an appropriate Summary, Rationale, Proposed Details
> and Impact.
>
>
>
> 2. General comments on change proposal
>
>
>
> a) Rationale
>
> real world examples gathered on the whatwg wiki do not reflect a compelling
> pattern or need for hgroup, but they do reflect the usefulness of an element
> that can be used as an indication that its content is a subheading,
> subtitle, tagline and byline. This can be shown by examples of subline use
> with the real world use cases provided.
>
> Your assertion “do not reflect a compelling pattern or need for hgroup”
> needs to be better instantiated.  Some of this proof may be in your examples
> of subline use but your argument would be stronger if you included this
> material directly in your change proposal.
>
>
>
>>The hgroup element has not been generally well received by authors:
>
>>Or by people involved in HTML5 specification development:
>
>
>
> You are making your rationale by reference here without outlining any of the
> arguments made by the referenced people or documents.  Your position would
> be much stronger if you summarized the major arguments made in each of your
> references directly in your Change Proposal.
>
>
>
> •  Or by implementors: in terms of its semantics and effect on the outline
> algorithm
>
>                            o  zero implementations
>
>
>
> This statement conflicts directly with the statement in the zero change
> proposal: “<hgroup> support has been shipped in multiple browsers”.  See the
> Rationale in:
>
> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2011Nov/0031.html   Your
> change proposal would be stronger if you could provide concrete evidence to
> refute the position in the other change proposal.
>
>
>
> b) Details
>
>
>
>>Remove the hgroup element from HTML5
>
>>Add the subline element to HTML5
>
>
>
> These Details are possibly inadequate.  If the first instruction is
> referring to just Section 4.4.7 The hgroup element then it omits the other
> mentions to hgroup in the HTML5 specification.  In addition the second
> instruction to add the proposed subline element omits any indication if
> subline should be added to any other sections in the document to replace the
> hgroup occurrences.
>
>
>
> Please let the Chairs know by Tue Jul 31 if you plan to revise your change
> proposal and when you can do the revision by.
>
>
>
> /paulc
>
> HTML WG co-chair
>
>
>
> Paul Cotton, Microsoft Canada
>
> 17 Eleanor Drive, Ottawa, Ontario K2E 6A3
>
> Tel: (425) 705-9596 Fax: (425) 936-7329
>
>
Received on Wednesday, 25 July 2012 13:29:39 UTC

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