- From: Leif Halvard Silli <xn--mlform-iua@xn--mlform-iua.no>
- Date: Fri, 27 Jan 2012 11:32:02 +0100
- To: Matthew Turvey <mcturvey@gmail.com>
- Cc: Leif Halvard Silli <xn--mlform-iua@xn--mlform-iua.no>, Silvia Pfeiffer <silviapfeiffer1@gmail.com>, Laura Carlson <laura.lee.carlson@gmail.com>, Sam Ruby <rubys@intertwingly.net>, Paul Cotton <Paul.Cotton@microsoft.com>, Maciej Stachowiak <mjs@apple.com>, HTML WG <public-html@w3.org>
Matthew Turvey, Fri, 27 Jan 2012 10:01:09 +0000: > On 26 January 2012 14:12, Leif Halvard Silli wrote: > The change proposal endorsed by the HTML-A11Y-TF (which you were a > member of at the time) clearly regards invisibility as an essential > feature of longdesc. For example: > > "[longdesc] does not force a visual encumbrance or default visual > indicator on sighted users. " > http://www.w3.org/html/wg/wiki/ChangeProposals/InstateLongdesc/Conclusion That's a statement about the *indication* of longdesc. > So a non-hidden longdesc would only meet 3 of the 10 use cases > proposed by the HTML-A11Y-TF. Again, you are discussing the *indication* of longdesc. My comment, by contrast, was related to the *content* which aria-describedby points to. I have *not* denied that the use of @hidden hides the content - it does of course has an advantage, in that sense. But despite what you have picked form the CP, the CP also describes how UAs can indicate to *all* users that there is @longdesc. > Note this invisibility requirement appears to contradict WCAG2's POUR > principles. If we want to go down that path, the HTML-A11Y-TF should > probably file a bug on WCAG2 to change the acronym to POURI, with the > "I" standing for "Invisible". Or "Imperceivable". Regardless, WG > participants have had plenty of time to submit an alternative change > proposal for a visible-by-default longdesc. HTML-A11Y-TF participants > also had plenty of time to amend Laura's CP before endorsing it. What you say does not completely make sense: @longdesc - and any link, such as <a> and <area> - is forbidden from pointing to a @hidden section. But @aria-describedby could very well point to a @hidden section. However such a hidden section would be hidden from sighted users too. By contrast, @longdesc can just point to another page or section on the same page, that anyone could read. >> Also if the zero change proposal, due to its current concurrence with >> Jonas' proposal in this detail, now is considered to reflect what Jonas >> proposed, then should it not offer offer the same use cases as Jonas >> was asked to provide? > > It's unclear what you mean here. Could you elaborate? I only mean that the ZCP should justify why it is necessary to be able to point to @hidden content. -- leif halvard silli
Received on Friday, 27 January 2012 10:32:41 UTC