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Re: False aria-describedby expectations in ARIA Authoring Practices (longdesc)

From: Steve Faulkner <faulkner.steve@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2011 21:14:21 +0100
Message-Id: <C1C69F5E-B993-4147-A7FC-8B64C833F82A@gmail.com>
Cc: Leif Halvard Silli <xn--mlform-iua@xn--mlform-iua.no>, Michael Cooper <cooper@w3.org>, Joseph Scheuhammer <clown@alum.mit.edu>, W3C WAI-XTECH <wai-xtech@w3.org>, HTMLwg <public-html@w3.org>, Richard Schwerdtfeger <schwer@us.ibm.com>, David Bolter <dbolter@mozilla.com>
To: Jonas Sicking <jonas@sicking.cc>
Hi Jonas 

"By modifying the code that reads from the DOM and exposes the relevant information to AT."

Can you provide the code or a link to the patch?

You wrote:
"Possibly, but wouldn't we be building a better world by leaning on browser vendors to fix their aria implementations, rather than leaningon aria authors to tell them to "dumb down" their aria usage."

Providing authoring guidance on what works leads to better practical outcomes for users. Leading developers to code to fictional features does not.

Regards
Steve



On 25 Apr 2011, at 20:58, Jonas Sicking <jonas@sicking.cc> wrote:

> On Fri, Apr 22, 2011 at 11:40 PM, Steve Faulkner
> <faulkner.steve@gmail.com> wrote:
>> hi jonas,
>> 
>>> Like I said, this was a patch to the code that exposes content to AT
>>> users.
>> 
>> how does it do so?
>> 
>> what mecahnism does it use to provide access /point to  to structured
>> content only for AT users.
> 
> By modifying the code that reads from the DOM and exposes the relevant
> information to AT.
> 
>> But having read further i do think you are correct in your interpretation
>> 
>> from the aria implementaion guide:
>> 
>> "Note that aria-describedby may reference structured or interactive
>> information where users would want to be able to navigate to different
>> sections of content. User agents MAY provide a way for the user to
>> navigate to structured information referenced by aria-describedby and
>> assistive technology SHOULD provide such a method."
>> http://www.w3.org/TR/wai-aria-implementation/#mapping_additional_relations
>> 
>> still the problem being that there is no requirment on either browsers
>> or AT to do so and as implemented none do it.
>> 
>> So in regards to the leifs original issue with the authoring guide, I
>> still think he is correct and that until such times that
>> aria-describedby is implemented in a way that matches the authoring
>> advice it is misleading and inaccurate.
> 
> Possibly, but wouldn't we be building a better world by leaning on
> browser vendors to fix their aria implementations, rather than leaning
> on aria authors to tell them to "dumb down" their aria usage.
> 
> Maybe adding a note saying that aria implementations are still lacking
> in this area and describe their limitation would be a good step
> forward. That would both tell authors about what works in current
> browsers, *and* exert pressure on browsers to fix their bugs.
> 
> / Jonas
Received on Monday, 25 April 2011 20:23:22 UTC

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