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Re: aside and figure elements

From: Leif Halvard Silli <xn--mlform-iua@xn--mlform-iua.no>
Date: Mon, 7 Jun 2010 19:41:37 +0200
To: Steven Faulkner <faulkner.steve@gmail.com>
Cc: Bruce Lawson <brucel@opera.com>, Laura Carlson <laura.lee.carlson@gmail.com>, Shelley Powers <shelleyp@burningbird.net>, HTML WG <public-html@w3.org>, HTML Accessibility Task Force <public-html-a11y@w3.org>
Message-ID: <20100607194137675180.f849919f@xn--mlform-iua.no>
Steven Faulkner, Mon, 7 Jun 2010 18:34:40 +0100:
> hi leif,
> 
>> But this does not rule out using <figure role="img">
> 
> ONLY if the images are meant to be percieved as a single image:
> 
> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/aria/roles#img
> "An img represents a single graphic within a document, whether or not
> it is formed by a collection of drawing objects."

Right. But that is the kind of debate we have? This debate does focus 
almost solely on the case when <figure> is used to give an <img> a 
caption.

Leif H.

> regards
> stevef
> 
> 2010/6/7 Leif Halvard Silli <xn--mlform-iua@xn--mlform-iua.no>:
>> Steven Faulkner, Mon, 7 Jun 2010 16:19:11 +0100:
>>>> Again, Steve, you did not answer one of my questions previously: what
>>>> is the default ARIA role for <figure> *itself*?
>>> 
>>> leif try reading what i wrote in my original email on this thread:
>>> 
>>> # <figure> should be mapped to accessibility APIs as a grouping
>>> element like <p> or <div>
>>> 
>>> in other words role="group"
>> 
>> Thanks, I'm sorry I did not looked harder before asking. But this does
>> not rule out using <figure role="img">. Firstly, quoting ARIA,
>> role="img" designate a group *as well*:
>> 
>> ]]
>> group
>>    A set of user interface objects which are not intended be included
>> in a page summary or table of contents by assistive technologies.
>> []
>> img
>>    A container for a collection of elements that form an image.
>> [[
>> 
>> Secondly, an img doesn't take part in in the TOC.
>> 
>> Leif Halvard Silli
>> 
>>> regards
>>> stevef
>>> 
>>> On 7 June 2010 16:10, Leif Halvard Silli
>>> <xn--mlform-iua@xn--mlform-iua.no> wrote:
>>>> Steven Faulkner, Mon, 7 Jun 2010 15:19:09 +0100:
>>>>> hi bruce,
>>>>> 
>>>>>> <figure>
>>>>>> <img src=ceo.jpg alt="">
>>>>>> <figcaption>Brian Slick, CEO of Blammo Corp, leveraging a
>>>>>> synergy</figcaption>
>>>>>> </figure>
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> seems entirely accessible (?)
>>>>> 
>>>>> the issue i see with this is that using alt="" says the image can be
>>>>> safely ignored. A caption is a label for something so the presence of
>>>>> the image needs to be exposed.
>>>> 
>>>> This is no different from the WAI-ARIA example - WAI-ARIA does not
>>>> think it has to "be exposed":
>>>> 
>>>> <div role="img" aria-labelledby="caption">
>>>> <img src="example.png" role="presentation" alt="">
>>>> <p id="caption">A visible text caption labeling the image.</p>
>>>> </div>
>>>> 
>>>>> when <figcaption> is supported in browsers the mapping will be
>>>>> provided so that:
>>>>> 
>>>>> <figure><img src=ceo.jpg alt="Brian Slick, CEO of Blammo Corp,
>>>>> leveraging a synergy"></figure>
>>>>> 
>>>>> and
>>>>> 
>>>>> <figure>
>>>>> <img src=ceo.jpg>
>>>>> <figcaption>Brian Slick, CEO of Blammo Corp, leveraging a
>>>>> synergy</figcaption>
>>>>> </figure>
>>>>> 
>>>>> will both provide the accessible name as "Brian Slick, CEO of Blammo
>>>>> Corp, leveraging a synergy"
>>>> 
>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> The proper solution to Bruce's example ought to be be this:
>>>> 
>>>> <figure role="img" >
>>>> <img src=ceo.jpg alt="">
>>>> <summary>Brian Slick, CEO of Blammo Corp, leveraging a
>>>> synergy</sumamry>
>>>> </figure>
>>>> 
>>>> Yes, there are some backward compatibility issues. We have to discuss
>>>> how we can be *both* backward compatible *and* HTML5 compatible.
>>>> --
>>>> leif halvard silli
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> --
>>> with regards
>>> 
>>> Steve Faulkner
>>> Technical Director - TPG Europe
>>> Director - Web Accessibility Tools Consortium
>>> 
>>> www.paciellogroup.com | www.wat-c.org
>>> Web Accessibility Toolbar -
>>> http://www.paciellogroup.com/resources/wat-ie-about.html
>> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> with regards
> 
> Steve Faulkner
> Technical Director - TPG Europe
> Director - Web Accessibility Tools Consortium
> 
> www.paciellogroup.com | www.wat-c.org
> Web Accessibility Toolbar -
> http://www.paciellogroup.com/resources/wat-ie-about.html
Received on Monday, 7 June 2010 17:42:48 GMT

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