W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > public-html@w3.org > December 2007

RE: Reserved keystrokes for borwsers and operating system functions

From: John Foliot <foliot@wats.ca>
Date: Wed, 19 Dec 2007 11:20:28 -0800
To: "'Aaron M Leventhal'" <aleventh@us.ibm.com>
Cc: "'W3C WAI-PFWG'" <w3c-wai-pf@w3.org>, <w3c-wai-pf-request@w3.org>, "'W3C WAI-XTECH'" <wai-xtech@w3.org>, <wai-xtech-request@w3.org>, "'HTMLWG'" <public-html@w3.org>
Message-ID: <011a01c84274$376a92f0$0400000a@Piglet>
Aaron (and others),
 
Back when XHTML2 WG was discussing @role, I tried very hard [
http://www.wats.ca/show.php?contentid=47 ] to have them exclude the @key
attribute in favor of placing the "discoverability" of these types of
enhancements on the shoulders of the user-agent and user.  Given the
multitude of possible web-apps that conceivably will emerge all wanting to
map to keyboard accelerators, there will always be a "battle" - if web app
A, web app G and web app W all want to map to [accelerator] + 6 how will
this be resolved?  To my mind, clearly, two of the 3 web app developers will
lose out.  (This does not even begin to also consider the i18n issue...)
 
On the other hand, if a user-agent, or combination of user-agent and
assistive technology are "alerted" to the existence of supplemental keyboard
accelerators 'embedded' into the app/page/plug-in, and then allows the
*user* to map a key to that 'point', then it would seem (to me anyway) that
everyone is happy: web app developer, *and* user.  Already we sort of have
this type of functionality within Opera - user customization of keystrokes.
 
In the interest of true accessibility and universality, it seems this should
be a no-brainer... (at least to me)
 
JF
 
 

-----Original Message-----
From: wai-xtech-request@w3.org [mailto:wai-xtech-request@w3.org] On Behalf
Of Aaron M Leventhal
Sent: December 19, 2007 9:48 AM
To: Wlodkowski, Thomas
Cc: Jon Gunderson; W3C WAI-PFWG; w3c-wai-pf-request@w3.org; W3C WAI-XTECH;
wai-xtech-request@w3.org
Subject: RE: Reserved keystrokes for borwsers and operating system functions



BTW we have the same issue with plugins. 

Right now when they have focus they steal *all* keystrokes and the browser
gets none. 

There was a developer suggesting we change things around and only allow
content/plugins to get keystrokes we don't absolutely need. It brings up a
lot of concerns, but I'm not sure I'd rule out that approach entirely. It
needs to be considered. 

- Aaron 





"Wlodkowski, Thomas" <Thomas.Wlodkowski@corp.aol.com> 
Sent by: w3c-wai-pf-request@w3.org 


12/19/2007 12:24 PM 


To
Aaron M Leventhal/Cambridge/IBM@IBMUS, "Jon Gunderson" <jongund@uiuc.edu> 

cc
"W3C WAI-PFWG" <w3c-wai-pf@w3.org>, "W3C WAI-XTECH" <wai-xtech@w3.org>,
<wai-xtech-request@w3.org> 

Subject
RE: Reserved keystrokes for borwsers and operating system functions

	




The battle between widgets and browser access to the keyboard is why the AXS
library developed by Chris Blouch on my team now uses Alt+Control+the letter
key. 
  
To be honest, I'm not sure how the keyboard battle is resolved if there
isn't some path toward better cooperation between the widget and browser. My
company develops web apps that in many cases replace software applications.
I suspect consumers want the same or equivalent behaviors when they're
accessing email via a webmail app. Hopefully this issue will spark greater
participation in the DHTML Style Guide working group that meets weekly on
Tuesdays at noon. You can see the widget-specific keyboard behaviors
discussed thus far at: 
 <http://dev.aol.com/dhtml_style_guide> http://dev.aol.com/dhtml_style_guide

  
Tom 
  
  

  _____  


From: wai-xtech-request@w3.org [mailto:wai-xtech-request@w3.org] On Behalf
Of Aaron M Leventhal
Sent: Tuesday, December 18, 2007 3:31 PM
To: Jon Gunderson
Cc: W3C WAI-PFWG; W3C WAI-XTECH; wai-xtech-request@w3.org
Subject: Re: Reserved keystrokes for borwsers and operating system functions


I have an old list but it should be updated. Could be a great resources if
it was. 
http://www.mozilla.org/access/keyboard/ 

Anyway, in the case of Alt+left it didn't appear the grid really meant to
use it. Better to check always the modifier key and let it go if it's not
the key you're looking for. 

- Aaron 



Jon Gunderson <jongund@uiuc.edu> 


12/18/2007 03:27 PM 




To
Aaron M Leventhal/Cambridge/IBM@IBMUS 

cc
W3C WAI-PFWG <w3c-wai-pf@w3.org>, W3C WAI-XTECH <wai-xtech@w3.org>,
wai-xtech-request@w3.org 

Subject
Reserved keystrokes for borwsers and operating system functions


	





Aaron,
Is there a list of key combinations that ARIA (Web 2.0) applications should
never use?

There are already some conflicts in the best practices, in that case the
best practices says the Widget should win.

Are these combinations going to be OS and browser specific?

Jon


---- Original message ----
>Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2007 14:53:54 -0500
>From: Aaron M Leventhal <aleventh@us.ibm.com>  
>Subject: Re: Updated Illinois ARIA Examples  
>To: Jon Gunderson <jongund@uiuc.edu>
>Cc: W3C WAI-PFWG <w3c-wai-pf@w3.org>, W3C WAI-XTECH <wai-xtech@w3.org>,
wai-xtech-request@w3.org
>
>   I see a bug in the grid example.
>
>   If I hit Alt+left or Alt+right to move in my browser
>   history, it moves in the grid instead. The script is
>   stealing those keystrokes instead of letting it go
>   to the browser.
>   You have to return true from your event handler if
>   the key was not used. That lets it bubble to the
>   next possible handler.
>
>   - Aaron
>
>   Jon Gunderson                 To W3C WAI-PFWG         
>   <jongund@uiuc.edu>               <w3c-wai-pf@w3.org>, 
>   Sent by:                         W3C WAI-XTECH        
>   wai-xtech-request@w3.org         <wai-xtech@w3.org>   
>                                 cc                      
>   12/17/2007 05:46 PM      Subject Updated Illinois     
>                                    ARIA Examples        
>                                                         
>
>   I have update the following examples to use the
>   non-namespaced version of the ARIA markup:
>
>   Menubar
>   http://test.cita.uiuc.edu/aria/menubar/
>
>   Grid
>   http://test.cita.uiuc.edu/aria/grid/
>
>   Slider
>   http://test.cita.uiuc.edu/aria/slider/
>
>   Slider
>   http://test.cita.uiuc.edu/aria/slider/
>
>   Tab Panel
>   http://test.cita.uiuc.edu/aria/tabpanel/
>   Jon Gunderson, Ph.D.
>   Coordinator of Assistive Communication and
>   Information Technology (DRES)
>
>   WWW: http://www.cita.uiuc.edu/
>   WWW: https://netfiles.uiuc.edu/jongund/www/
Jon Gunderson, Ph.D.
Coordinator of Assistive Communication and Information Technology (DRES)

WWW: http://www.cita.uiuc.edu/
WWW: https://netfiles.uiuc.edu/jongund/www/
Received on Wednesday, 19 December 2007 19:21:20 UTC

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