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RE: Version information

From: Chris Wilson <Chris.Wilson@microsoft.com>
Date: Sat, 7 Apr 2007 11:35:38 -0700
To: Alfonso Martínez de Lizarrondo <amla70@gmail.com>
CC: Maciej Stachowiak <mjs@apple.com>, Anne van Kesteren <annevk@opera.com>, "L. David Baron" <dbaron@dbaron.org>, "public-html@w3.org" <public-html@w3.org>
Message-ID: <5C276AFCCD083E4F94BD5C2DA883F05A27D6D61A1C@tk5-exmlt-w600.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com>
Yes, we will require opt-ins to turn on "really really" standards mode in future versions of IE.  Every time this WG releases a new version of HTML, if we can identify it we can automatically opt it in to "really really" standards mode.  Otherwise, if it is effectively indistinguishable from the HTML that is on the web today, that relies on incorrect-but-unchangeable-for-compat reasons, we will be forced to render it in quirks mode.

From: Alfonso Martínez de Lizarrondo [mailto:amla70@gmail.com]
Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2007 2:22 AM
To: Chris Wilson
Cc: Maciej Stachowiak; Anne van Kesteren; L. David Baron; public-html@w3.org
Subject: Re: Version information


And that is our plan, except I think perhaps our definitions of "too extreme" differ.  We can't, for example, change the behavior of how we support CSS floats in IE7 without requiring an opt-in, since we would change layout significantly for half the web.*  When we break the web, it's our fault, even when we're breaking it to improve standards compliance.

We (Microsoft) want to and plan to continue to bring our implementation in ever-higher compliance with the standards.  We can't change our behavior for content that exists today, though, so we will have to have content developers opt in.  I'd like to know when someone is creating HTML 5 content, because (just like Quirks mode) that tells me when the last time they looked at the standards was.  Same with HTML 6, etc.


But imagine for a moment that this group didn't exist and no HTML 5 will ever be published.

You have just stated that Microsoft want to improve the compliance with the standards, that means HTML 4.01 and CSS2, fixing the bugs in those implementations shouldn't require a new version of HTML or CSS. Web authors will need a way to use the new fixes and leave the old workarounds like legacy content, but the opt-in method doesn't has to be a version information header in the HTML, because after all they'll be addressing differences in the rendering of the same standard between two versions of the same browser, and the web authors can't state that they want the HTML 5 rendering mode because as I said this group doesn't exist.

There must be another way to trigger the really-really standards mode in IE7+ (and in the more distant future make that the default standards mode)

Regards
Received on Saturday, 7 April 2007 18:35:45 UTC

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