{minutes} HTML WG Telecon 2010-12-16: status of actions, calls, new decisions, task force reports from Paul Cotton on 2010-12-16 (public-html-wg-announce@w3.org from October to December 2010)

From: Paul Cotton <Paul.Cotton@microsoft.com>
Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2010 21:54:35 +0000
To: "public-html-wg-announce@w3.org" <public-html-wg-announce@w3.org>
Message-ID: <E3EACD022300B94D88613639CF4E25F818550ECC@TK5EX14MBXC136.redmond.corp.microsoft.>
The minutes for the Dec 16 HTML WG Weekly meeting can be found below and at:


http://www.w3.org/2010/12/16-html-wg-minutes.html



/paulc

Paul Cotton, Microsoft Canada
17 Eleanor Drive, Ottawa, Ontario K2E 6A3
Tel: (425) 705-9596 Fax: (425) 936-7329


[Description: W3C]<http://www.w3.org/>

- DRAFT -
HTML Weekly Teleconference
16 Dec 2010

Agenda<http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2010Dec/0144.html>

Attendees
Present
Regrets
Gregory_Rosmaita
Chair
SV_MEETING_CHAIR
Scribe
mjs
Contents

  *   Topics<http://www.w3.org/2010/12/16-html-wg-minutes.html#agenda>
     *   action items due this week<http://www.w3.org/2010/12/16-html-wg-minutes.html#item01>
     *   new issues this week<http://www.w3.org/2010/12/16-html-wg-minutes.html#item02>
     *   Items closed last week<http://www.w3.org/2010/12/16-html-wg-minutes.html#item03>
     *   items closing this week<http://www.w3.org/2010/12/16-html-wg-minutes.html#item04>
     *   items closing next week<http://www.w3.org/2010/12/16-html-wg-minutes.html#item05>
     *   new calls this week<http://www.w3.org/2010/12/16-html-wg-minutes.html#item06>
     *   New surveys this week<http://www.w3.org/2010/12/16-html-wg-minutes.html#item07>
     *   decisions this week<http://www.w3.org/2010/12/16-html-wg-minutes.html#item08>
     *   task force reports<http://www.w3.org/2010/12/16-html-wg-minutes.html#item09>
     *   other business<http://www.w3.org/2010/12/16-html-wg-minutes.html#item10>
     *   adjournment<http://www.w3.org/2010/12/16-html-wg-minutes.html#item11>
  *   Summary of Action Items<http://www.w3.org/2010/12/16-html-wg-minutes.html#ActionSummary>

________________________________

<pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 10723] support for media fragment URIs in relevant HTML5 elements <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Dec/0478.html>

<pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 11559] New: User agent should not be required to filter suggestions from datalist <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Dec/0479.html>

<pimpbot> planet: Jesper Kristensen: Firefox/Gecko Delivery Meeting Minutes: 2010-12-15 <11http://blog.mozilla.com/meeting-notes/archives/456>

<CIA-1> htmlr: 03Michael(tm) Smith 07gh-pages * rc13d5d1 10/ (17 files in 2 dirs): added explanation of implied start and end tags - http://bit.ly/i6erJN

<pimpbot> Title: Commit c13d5d1bd3f9adbe29a3665681adb4948f5b3de9 to sideshowbarker's htmlr - GitHub (at bit.ly)

<pimpbot> changes: mike: added explanation of implied start and end tags <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-diffs/2010Dec/0055.html>

<pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 11560] New: object width="600" height="409"> <param name="movie" value="http://fpdownload.adobe.com/strobe/FlashMediaPlayback.swf"></param><param name="flashvars" value="src=http%3A%2F%2Fosmf.org%2Fvideos%2Fcathy2.flv"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="tru <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Dec/0480.html>

<pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 10723] support for media fragment URIs in relevant HTML5 elements <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Dec/0481.html>

<pimpbot> planet: brucel: I know I'm *supposed* to say it, but O11 is the best yet. I'm delighted with the new Mail panel (much tidier for me), extensions. And #html5 <11http://twitter.com/brucel/statuses/15321539490611200> 4** brucel: Opera 11 is out and you can build extensions for it using HTML5, JS, CSS... http://goo.gl/Dtqji is the place to start. <11http://twitter.com/brucel/statuses/15317246964408320> 4** brucel: Opera 11 is out: extensions, tab stacki

<pimpbot> planet: brucel: .@smiffy More a la Chrome: HTML, CSS, JS, SVG: packaged as W3C Widget, talking to page via HTML5 postmessage. Docs: http://bit.ly/gXGRgF <11http://twitter.com/brucel/statuses/15326456582246400>

<pimpbot> planet: stevefaulkner: be aware when using the #W3C or validator.nu to check #HTML5 docs containing #ARIA the validation rules are out of date #a11y <11http://twitter.com/stevefaulkner/statuses/15348807055179776>

<pimpbot> planet: Doctype.com: Why is Floated Sidebar Inheriting CSS Formating From Another Element <11http://doctype.com/floated-sidebar-inheriting-css-formating-from-another-element>

<pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 11554] :read-write selector spec is ambiguous on editable input/textarea fields <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Dec/0483.html> 4** [Bug 11562] New: address tag definition has no relation to it's name <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Dec/0482.html>

<pimpbot> changes: sam: Remove extraneous close tag <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-diffs/2010Dec/0057.html> 4** sam: Remove extraneous character <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-diffs/2010Dec/0056.html>

<pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 7727] legacy doc type does not need to be discouraged by "SHOULD NOT" <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Dec/0485.html> 4** "[Bug 11554] :read-write selector spec is ambiguous on editable input/textarea fields" (2 messages in thread) <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Dec/0484.html>

<pimpbot> planet: brucel: Chums over the pond: Opera 11 is out. Build extensions for it using HTML5, JS, CSS: http://goo.gl/Dtqji is place to start RT @andreasbovens <11http://twitter.com/brucel/statuses/15408740777861121> 4** zcorpan: @souders http://www.whatwg.org/specs/web-apps/current-work/complete/apis-in-html-documents.html#document.write() maybe? <11http://twitter.com/zcorpan/statuses/15402689865191424>

<pimpbot> planet: cheilmann: Spirit of Indiana (Jones) - syncing HTML5 Video with Maps <11http://hacks.mozilla.org/2010/12/spirit-of-indiana-jones-syncing-html5-video-with-maps/>

<pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 11326] A proposal to add web application access to home network A/V devices and content <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Dec/0487.html> 4** [Bug 11562] address tag definition has no relation to it's name <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Dec/0486.html>

<pimpbot> changes: eliot: Added missing <tbody> element in second table example in sample page code, per bug 11525. <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-diffs/2010Dec/0058.html>

<pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 11525] Missing tbody element <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Dec/0488.html>

<rubys> trackbot, start meeting

<trackbot> Date: 16 December 2010

<scribe> ScribeNick: mjs

<pimpbot> Title: {agenda} HTML WG Telecon 2010-12-16: status of actions, calls, new decisions, task force reports from Paul Cotton on 2010-12-15 (public-html@w3.org from December 2010) (at lists.w3.org)

<pimpbot> planet: brucel: Oi, @mrlastweek - where's your blog gone?!?!?! #html5 <11http://twitter.com/brucel/statuses/15431572459102208>
action items due this week

Paul: ACTION-190

ACTION-190?

<trackbot> ACTION-190 -- Michael(tm) Smith to fix pubrules problems with "author-only" view of the HTML5 specification -- due 2010-12-10 -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/190

<pimpbot> Title: ACTION-190: Fix pubrules problems with "author-only" view of the HTML5 specification - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

Paul: short summary, Mike said this was hard because the document is autogenerated

<paulc> ACTION-190 on Jan 7, 2011

Paul: he thinks he can fix it before our next publication date

<paulc> ACTION-190 is due on Jan 7, 2011

<rubys> ACTION-190 due on Jan 7, 2011

<trackbot> ACTION-190 Fix pubrules problems with "author-only" view of the HTML5 specification due date now on Jan 7, 2011

Paul: next action item - ACTION-193, co-chairs to follow up on standardization of WebSRT

ACTION-193?

<trackbot> ACTION-193 -- Paul Cotton to and co-chairs to investigate how to handle standardization of websrt -- due 2010-12-16 -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/193

<pimpbot> Title: ACTION-193: And co-chairs to investigate how to handle standardization of websrt - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

<paulc> ACTION-193 is due on Jan 7, 2011

<paulc> ACTION-193 due on jan 7, 2011

<trackbot> ACTION-193 And co-chairs to investigate how to handle standardization of websrt due date now on jan 7, 2011
new issues this week

Paul: none, but we do have TrackerRequests

http://w3.org/Bugs/Public/buglist.cgi?product=HTML+WG&keywords=TrackerRequest

<pimpbot> Title: Bug List (at w3.org)
Items closed last week

Paul: 6 items on my original list
... first one is ISSUE-128, straw poll for objections

ISSUE-128?

<trackbot> ISSUE-128 -- Authors should be able to use <figure> where <img> can be used -- open

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/128

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-128: Authors should be able to use where can be used - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

Paul: ISSUE-124 on rel-limits, we asked for alternate proposals, and received two total

ISSUE-124?

<trackbot> ISSUE-124 -- nofollow/noreferrer not allowed on <link> -- open

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/124

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-124: nofollow/noreferrer not allowed on - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

Paul: next item, ISSUE-130

ISSUE-130?

<trackbot> ISSUE-130 -- allow tables to be used for layout purposes -- open

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/130

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-130: allow tables to be used for layout purposes - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

Paul: Chairs declared it closed without prejudice, but we received a Change Proposal, so it has been reopened

<paulc> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2010Dec/0132.html

<pimpbot> Title: Issue 130 from Richard Schwerdtfeger on 2010-12-15 (public-html@w3.org from December 2010) (at lists.w3.org)

Paul: next item is ISSUE-132, drop-color-input

has been closed without prejudice

ISSUE-132?

<trackbot> ISSUE-132 -- Drop the color input type -- closed

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/132

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-132: Drop the color input type - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

Paul: going on to 133

ISSUE-133?

<trackbot> ISSUE-133 -- Add a modal attribute to html5 to indicate a modal segment of the DOM (modal dialog) -- closed

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/133

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-133: Add a modal attribute to html5 to indicate a modal segment of the DOM (modal dialog) - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

Paul: modal attribute; no Change Proposal received, has been closed without prejudice

Janina: original 133 author dropped out, now assigned to Cynthia

Paul: (advises Cynthia to simply submit the Change Proposal once ready)

Cynthia: ok

Paul: just request for it to be reopened once ready
... moving on to issue 137 case-insensitive

ISSUE-137?

<trackbot> ISSUE-137 -- Since Javascript does not support mode specifiers inside the regular expression, there is no simple way of matching a single word case-insensitively besides turning into [Ww][Oo][Rr][Dd] -- closed

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/137

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-137: Since Javascript does not support mode specifiers inside the regular expression, there is no simple way of matching a single word case-insensitively besides turning into [Ww][Oo][Rr][Dd] - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

Paul: also closed without prejudice for lack of proposals
... any questions?
items closing this week

Paul: ISSUE-118 broken-link-types, closes today

<pimpbot> changes: eliot: changed <mathml> --> <math> per bug 11522 <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-diffs/2010Dec/0059.html>

http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/40318/issue-118-objection-poll/results

<pimpbot> Title: Results of Questionnaire ISSUE-118 Specification breaks semantics of existing link relations "index" and "first" - Straw Poll for Objections - Web-Based Straw-poll and Balloting System (at www.w3.org)

Paul, see poll link above

<rubys> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2010Dec/0085.html

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-118: broken-link-types - Straw Poll for Objections from Maciej Stachowiak on 2010-12-09 (public-html@w3.org from December 2010) (at lists.w3.org)

<pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 11563] New: asdasdasdasdasd asdasdasd aads asdas asdasdasda dasd asdasd <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Dec/0496.html> 4** [Bug 11529] inferred start tags <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Dec/0492.html> 4** [Bug 11526] newlines in attribute values <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2010Dec/0493.html> 4** [Bug 11524] valid XML documents. <11htt
items closing next week

Paul: there are none, due to the upcoming holiday period
new calls this week

Paul: four this week, ending January 26th

<paulc> ACTION-142?

<trackbot> ACTION-142 -- Philippe Le Hégaret to look into some questions we have about how the W3C Patent Policy obligations would apply to a joint TF. -- due 2009-09-17 -- CLOSED

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/142

<pimpbot> Title: ACTION-142: Look into some questions we have about how the W3C Patent Policy obligations would apply to a joint TF. - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

Paul: first is ISSUE-142 poster-alt

Janina: there doesn't seem to be unanimity on this one; much discussion

Paul: next issue
... ISSUE-144 conforming-u

ISSUE-144?

<trackbot> ISSUE-144 -- <u> should be conforming -- raised

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/144

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-144: should be conforming - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

Paul: next new call is ISSUE-145 codecs-vs-octet; also closes January 26th

ISSUE-145?

<trackbot> ISSUE-145 -- use of "codecs" parameter -- raised

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/145

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-145: use of "codecs" parameter - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

Paul: and finally, ISSUE-146, video-content-muted

ISSUE-146?

<trackbot> ISSUE-146 -- <video> should allow muted as a content attribute -- raised

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/146

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-146: should allow muted as a content attribute - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

Paul: any comments?
New surveys this week

Paul: none this week
decisions this week

Paul: two double-issue decisions
... first was ISSUE-4 / ISSUE-84

http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/40318/issue-118-objection-poll/results

<pimpbot> Title: Results of Questionnaire ISSUE-118 Specification breaks semantics of existing link relations "index" and "first" - Straw Poll for Objections - Web-Based Straw-poll and Balloting System (at www.w3.org)

ISSUE-4?

<trackbot> ISSUE-4 -- HTML Versioning and DOCTYPEs -- closed

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/4

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-4: HTML Versioning and DOCTYPEs - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

ISSUE-84?

<trackbot> ISSUE-84 -- Should spec discourage use of "legacy" doctypes? -- closed

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/84

<paulc> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2010Dec/0135.html

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-84: Should spec discourage use of "legacy" doctypes? - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

<pimpbot> Title: Working Group Decision on ISSUE-4 (html-versioning) and ISSUE-84 (legacy-doctypes) from Sam Ruby on 2010-12-15 (public-html@w3.org from December 2010) (at lists.w3.org)

Paul: any comments?
... next is ISSUE-74 / ISSUE-105

ISSUE-74?

<trackbot> ISSUE-74 -- How accessibility works for <canvas> is unclear. -- closed

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/74

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-74: How accessibility works for is unclear. - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

ISSUE-105?

<trackbot> ISSUE-105 -- allow image maps on the canvas element -- closed

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/105

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-105: allow image maps on the canvas element - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

<paulc> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2010Dec/0136.html

<pimpbot> Title: Working Group Decision on ISSUE-74 canvas-accessibility and ISSUE-105 canvas-usemap from Maciej Stachowiak on 2010-12-15 (public-html@w3.org from December 2010) (at lists.w3.org)

Paul: any comments?
task force reports

Paul: Testing task force first

Kris: hello
... it's gotten slow on the list

<krisk> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-testsuite/2010Dec/0011.html

<pimpbot> Title: HTML Testing Task Force Conf Call Agenda 12/14/2010 from Kris Krueger on 2010-12-14 (public-html-testsuite@w3.org from December 2010) (at lists.w3.org)

Kris: we met this week; a few people from Opera showed up
... list discussion is mostly from Mozilla/Google people about the harness

<plh> I wasn't able to attend the testing call this week, sorry Kris.

<krisk> thread about harness http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-testsuite/2010Dec/0012.html

<pimpbot> Title: RE: Request for Feedback On Test Harness from Kris Krueger on 2010-12-14 (public-html-testsuite@w3.org from December 2010) (at lists.w3.org)

Paul: anything else?

Kris: people are looking at Philip Taylor's canvas tests

Paul: whoah, bad echo

PLH: we are going to approve a bunch of tests

Paul: how many on deck?

Kris: about 500

PLH: what about the audio/video tests from Mark Pilgrim?

Kris: tests have feedback; need revision

<krisk> here is philip taylor's canvas tests http://test.w3.org/html/tests/submission/PhilipTaylor/

<pimpbot> Title: Index of /html/tests/submission/PhilipTaylor (at test.w3.org)

Paul: what is the approval date?

Kris: I sent it to the list

<krisk> jan 3rd

<krisk> see -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-testsuite/2010Dec/0011.html

<pimpbot> Title: HTML Testing Task Force Conf Call Agenda 12/14/2010 from Kris Krueger on 2010-12-14 (public-html-testsuite@w3.org from December 2010) (at lists.w3.org)

Paul: looking for feedback by January 3rd
... any questions for Kris?
... next up is Accessibility TF
... I hope you can cover the ISSUE-122 status

Janina: that and a couple of related issues, namely 80 and 31, we did indeed talk about
... we worked on resolving why we are stuck
... we thought we had agreement at TPAC
... but we had another proposal forwarded by someone very involved in the TF but not at TPAC or on the telecons
... we didn't think it was a good use of the WG's time to ask the WG to resolve between competing proposals
... trying to arrange identified small group to get together over the holidays
... a key person has a conflict with the usual telecon time
... hoping to resolve by end of the year, but there may just be two proposals

Paul: previously promised a proposal in 48 hours
... can we record a date for when we can expect a proposal?

Janina: January 7th

Paul: that covers the status of ISSUE-122
... any other task force related items?

Janina: promising summary overview of comparison between TTML and WebSRT
... thought we had it a week ago
... we thought we were ready, but there is some dispute over neutrality

<janina> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/TextFormat_Comparison_Overview

<pimpbot> Title: TextFormat Comparison Overview - HTML accessibility task force Wiki (at www.w3.org)

Janina: 36-hour consensus call; Friday afternoon we can forward it

Paul: (recaps category breakdown)
... you are presenting an analysis of the captioning format requirements

Janina: yes, related to the captioning format spec

Paul: what is the WG intended to do with this analysis?
... this is probably input for the captioning format related groups

Janina: that may be so
... WebSRT doesn't cover all requirements, but set of work items is contained
... TTML may need a profile

Paul: make sure to let the WG know what they should do with this document

Janina: we may need to do a two hour call

Paul: I want to encourage the TF to make sure you are aware of the January 22nd date; make sure to do a triage
other business

Paul: we had a CfC to publish

<paulc> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2010Dec/0135.html

<pimpbot> Title: Working Group Decision on ISSUE-4 (html-versioning) and ISSUE-84 (legacy-doctypes) from Sam Ruby on 2010-12-15 (public-html@w3.org from December 2010) (at lists.w3.org)

http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2010Dec/0078.html

<pimpbot> Title: CfC: Publish eight heartbeat drafts as WDs from Maciej Stachowiak on 2010-12-08 (public-html@w3.org from December 2010) (at lists.w3.org)

<anne> (FWIW, I asked Mike and since we're not publishing today I have not updated html5-diff.)

Paul: plan is to publish ASAP in January
... can we have a volunteer to scribe next time?
... it will be Sam's turn

(to chair)

paul: I don't hear any volunteers
adjournment

RRSAgent: prepare minutes

RRSAgent: generate minutes

Summary of Action Items
[End of minutes]
________________________________
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$Date: 2010/12/16 17:47:57 $
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