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Minutes 2009-09-24

From: Anne van Kesteren <annevk@opera.com>
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 18:47:41 +0200
To: public-html-wg-announce@w3.org
Message-ID: <op.u0rsxrwf64w2qv@annevk-t60>
http://www.w3.org/2009/09/24-html-wg-minutes.html


Attendees

    Present
           Eliot_Graff, carlos, Cynthia_Shelly, Sam, Matt, jerryEzrol,
           [Microsoft], Radhika_Roy, kliehm, +1.503.712.aaaa, julian,
           laura, msporny, Cooper, anne, Rich, [Apple], Mike, adrianba

    Chair
           paulc

    Scribe
           anne

Contents

      * [4]Topics
          1. [5]Agenda
          2. [6]ACTION-138 -- produce a matrix based on HS' work
          3. [7]ACTION-143 -- on PC; testing task force
          4. [8]about URI scheme
          5. [9]update IRI spec based on comments
          6. [10]outstanding CfC
          7. [11]HTML+RDFa
          8. [12]Joint HTML and PF WG Accessibility Task Force
          9. [13]7. HTML WG Testing Task Force
         10. [14]drag and drop discussion
         11. [15]discussion of summary
      * [16]Summary of Action Items
      _________________________________________________________



    <trackbot> Date: 24 September 2009

    <paulc> PaulC just joined.

    <scribe> scribe: anne

    <mjs> hi all

    <julian> [17]http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/agenda

      [17] http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/agenda

    <pimpbot> Title: Input for Agenda Planning for the HTML Weekly -
    HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

    [18]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-wg-announce/2009
    JulSep/0044.html

      [18]  
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-wg-announce/2009JulSep/0044.html

    <pimpbot> Title: Agenda for HTML WG telcon 2009-09-24 - CfCs,
    Accessibility TF, Testing TF, etc. from Paul Cotton on 2009-09-22
    (public-html-wg-announce@w3.org from July to September 2009) (at
    lists.w3.org)

    <pimpbot> Title: FW: Agenda for HTML WG telcon 2009-09-24 - CfCs,
    Accessibility TF, Testing TF, etc. from Paul Cotton on 2009-09-22
    (public-html@w3.org from September 2009) (at lists.w3.org)

Agenda

    PC: comments on the agenda? missed actions/items?
    ... lets assume this is ok

    <paulc> Topic ISSUE-35/ACTION-138: Produce a matrix based on Henri's
    work [Steve Faulkner]

    RS: I had one item about drag and drop
    ... I want to raise an issue on it
    ... can be put at the end

    LC: I have a procedural question about summary=""; can be put in the
    end

    PC: I will deal with those as item 9 and move adjourn to 10
    ... anything else?

ACTION-138 -- produce a matrix based on HS' work

    LC: about two weeks ago Steve did a pass on that, discussed it, and
    has since then not have time to work on it; it will be discussed
    again the week after next

    PC: lets move the action to October 8

    <paulc> change due date to oct 8

    LC: sounds good

    <MikeSmith> action-138 due 2009-10-08

    <trackbot> ACTION-138 Produce a matrix based on Henri's work due
    date now 2009-10-08

    <paulc> Topic ACTION-143: Get co-chairs to bring forward a concrete
    proposal for a testing task force (including scope) [Paul Cotton]

ACTION-143 -- on PC; testing task force

    ACTION-143?

    <trackbot> ACTION-143 -- Paul Cotton to get co-chairs to bring
    forward a concrete proposal for a testing task force (including
    scope) -- due 2009-09-17 -- OPEN

    <trackbot> [19]http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/143

      [19] http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/143

    <pimpbot> Title: ACTION-143 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

    <paulc> Proposal:
    [20]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2009Sep/0687.htm
    l

      [20] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2009Sep/0687.html

    <pimpbot> Title: RE: HTML WG Testing Task Force from Paul Cotton on
    2009-09-17 (public-html@w3.org from September 2009) (at
    lists.w3.org)

    PC: so far we have seen positive items; it seems that creating a TF
    is acceptable to everyone
    ... what we need now is a volunteer to get things going
    ... can I email to ask for volunteers?

    <rubys> +1

    MJS: sounds good

    <adrianba> +1

    <scribe> ACTION: paulc to ask for a volunteer to run the testing
    Task Force [recorded in
    [21]http://www.w3.org/2009/09/24-html-wg-minutes.html#action01]

    <trackbot> Created ACTION-146 - Ask for a volunteer to run the
    testing Task Force [on Paul Cotton - due 2009-10-01].

    PC: we wanted a way to figure out a way to be a member of the
    testing TF without getting email from the HTML WG

    MS: that is not possible because the subscription list of
    public-html is based on the HTML WG member database

    PC: what if they explicitly unsubscribe?

    MS: don't think that will work

    PC: so the only recourse would be for the TF members to set up a
    filter

    MS: most people use some kind of filtering already so this would
    just be another rule

    PC: just wanted to make sure that we dealt with item 2 under the
    proposal
    ... as AB from MS requested this feature

    <paulc> The following point will NOT be possible:

    <paulc> Note: We may want to figure out how to permit TF members to
    avoid receiving WG email.

    PC: OASIS is ahead of the W3C here

    <rubys> close action 143

    MS: [censored o_O]

    <paulc> Topic ISSUE-54/ACTION-103: Register about: URI scheme
    [Lachlan Hunt]

about URI scheme

    <masinter> there was mail on the about URI scheme this week

    MJS: he emailed on this last week

    <masinter>
    [22]http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/uri-review/current/msg01009
    .html

      [22]  
http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/uri-review/current/msg01009.html

    <pimpbot> Title: [Uri-review] draft-holsten-about-uri-scheme-02 (at
    www.ietf.org)

    MJS: we should probably roll over the action

    PC: I will change the due date to next week

    <paulc> See report in
    [23]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2009Sep/0684.htm
    l

      [23] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2009Sep/0684.html

    <pimpbot> Title: ACTION-103 Follow up on the about: scheme
    Registration from Lachlan Hunt on 2009-09-17 (public-html@w3.org
    from September 2009) (at lists.w3.org)

update IRI spec based on comments

    <paulc> Topic ISSUE-56/ACTION-137: Update IRI spec based on comments
    to Public-IRI [Larry Masinter]

    <MikeSmith> action-103 due 2009-09-24

    <trackbot> ACTION-103 Register about: URI scheme due date now
    2009-09-24

    MJS: I think LM emailed about this

    <masinter> the author/editor of the about URI scheme needs to
    respond to comments

    <masinter> yes, i'm in TAG meeting but we're about to break

    <paulc> see report in
    [24]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2009Sep/0982.htm
    l

      [24] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2009Sep/0982.html

    <pimpbot> Title: ACTION-137 on URI/IRI/URL from Larry Masinter on
    2009-09-24 (public-html@w3.org from September 2009) (at
    lists.w3.org)

    PC: this one appears to be in progress

    <masinter> i'm not on phone but i can respond to questions on IRC

    <paulc> "Updating due date to 9/28"

    ACTION-137?

    <trackbot> ACTION-137 -- Larry Masinter to update IRI spec based on
    comments to Public-IRI (Including those from HTML-WG members), --
    due 2009-09-28 -- PENDINGREVIEW

    <trackbot> [25]http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/137

      [25] http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/137

    <pimpbot> Title: ACTION-137 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

    <masinter> wait, should be OPEN not PENDINGREVIEW

outstanding CfC

    <paulc> Topic CfC: declare WebSockets out of scope [Maciej
    Stachowiak]

    <masinter> i will do yet another draft, think next monday, that's
    what i put in the tracker

    <paulc> Resolved without objection.

    PC: I believe the first one is resolved
    ... comments?

    <rubys> action-137?

    <trackbot> ACTION-137 -- Larry Masinter to update IRI spec based on
    comments to Public-IRI (Including those from HTML-WG members), --
    due 2009-09-28 -- OPEN

    <trackbot> [26]http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/137

      [26] http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/137

    <pimpbot> Title: ACTION-137 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

    <paulc> Topic CfC: Publish HTML+RDFa as First Public Working Draft
    [Maciej Stachowiak]

    PC: we haven't seen anyone to object to publication
    ... we have seen a lot of discussion on content

    <paulc> Resolved without objection to publish the first public WGD

    PC: resolved to publish without objection as FPWD
    ... I will work with Manu to get the document in shape

    Manu: that's be fantastic

    <scribe> ACTION: paulc to work with Manu on making HTML+RDFa ready
    to publish [recorded in
    [27]http://www.w3.org/2009/09/24-html-wg-minutes.html#action02]

    <trackbot> Created ACTION-147 - Work with Manu on making HTML+RDFa
    ready to publish [on Paul Cotton - due 2009-10-01].

HTML+RDFa

    Manu: after speaking with Henri and reading Maciej and Jonas'
    feedback it is clear that we need to clarify the current
    specification.
    ... with respect to DOM Level 2 and the infoset
    ... we'll start to move the issues from the RDFa wiki to the W3C
    issue tracker

    PC: do you want an action on this or is it obvious enough?
    ... the movement of the issues, in particular

    Manu: I wanted to put them in the RDFa TF tracker
    ... I can email it after the telcon

    MJS: I'd recommend putting them in W3C Bugzilla, not the Tracker

    <paulc> tx sam

    Manu: that might lead to some duplication between the RDFa and HTML
    tracker

Joint HTML and PF WG Accessibility Task Force

    <rubys>
    [28]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2009Sep/0956.htm
    l

      [28] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2009Sep/0956.html

    <pimpbot> Title: Re: Accessibility Task Force from Janina Sajka on
    2009-09-23 (public-html@w3.org from September 2009) (at
    lists.w3.org)

    <rubys> [29]http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/html-task-force

      [29] http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/html-task-force

    <pimpbot> Title: HTML Accessibility Task Force (at www.w3.org)

    PC: does anyone have any comments regarding the description on this
    TF?
    ... we handle the patent obligation by requiring members of the TF
    to be a member of the HTML WG

    <paulc> Who are the Task Force Facilitators?

    <scribe> ACTION: paulc to recruit a Task Force facilitator for the
    HTML WG [recorded in
    [30]http://www.w3.org/2009/09/24-html-wg-minutes.html#action03]

    <trackbot> Created ACTION-148 - Recruit a Task Force facilitator for
    the HTML WG [on Paul Cotton - due 2009-10-01].

    MC: can we record a formal resolution?

    MJS: if we want to record a resolution we should probably issue a
    CfC on the mailing list

    <scribe> ACTION: maciej to issue a CfC to approve the accessibility
    Task Force and testing Task Force [recorded in
    [31]http://www.w3.org/2009/09/24-html-wg-minutes.html#action04]

    <trackbot> Created ACTION-149 - Issue a CfC to approve the
    accessibility Task Force and testing Task Force [on Maciej
    Stachowiak - due 2009-10-01].

7. HTML WG Testing Task Force

    <paulc> Done above under the action items.

drag and drop discussion

    RS: the problem we have with the current specification is that it is
    mouse specific

    AvK: actually, the specification is already written in a way that it
    is keyboard accessible
    ... as a copy and paste operation

    MJS: the current specification dispatches the same events for copy
    and paste and drag and drop

    RS: we need to create an issue

    MJS: I would prefer to start with a bug in the bug tracker

    RS: who creates the bug?

    MJS: I would recommend you do it since you understand the issue

    You want:
    [32]http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/enter_bug.cgi?product=HTML%20WG

      [32] http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/enter_bug.cgi?product=HTML%20WG

    <pimpbot> Title: Log in to Bugzilla (at www.w3.org)

    <paulc> ack

    richardschwerdtfe, ^^

    MK: drag and drop has been under fire recently

    <julian>
    [33]http://www.quirksmode.org/blog/archives/2009/09/the_html5_drag.h
    tml

      [33]  
http://www.quirksmode.org/blog/archives/2009/09/the_html5_drag.html

    <pimpbot> Title: QuirksBlog: The HTML5 drag and drop disaster (at
    www.quirksmode.org)

    MK: I think people have asked to remove it from the HTML5
    specification, rewrite it, and handle it as a separate draft

    PC: so what you're saying is that this issue might be subsumed by
    drag and drop might be done in a different way

    <masinter> +1 to removing drag and drop, brings in all kinds of
    stuff

    MK: yes

    MJS: lets keep this as a separate issue

    PC: agreed

    MJS: Firefox, Safari, and Internet Explorer all implement the
    current model and it is therefore unlikely to go away
    ... but we can discuss this offline

discussion of summary

    LC: [scribe missed]

    MJS: the bug tracker should not affect your action on creating an
    alternative draft

    <julian> one of the bugs related to summary is
    [34]http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=7633

      [34] http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=7633

    LC, PC: thanks MJS

    <pimpbot> 117633: shelleyp@burningbird.net, P2, REOPENED, 13The use
    of @summary should be encouraged when circumstances warrant

    PC: volunteer to scribe next week?

    <paulc> Topic Scribe for next meeting

    PC: no volunteers
    ... adjourned


-- 
Anne van Kesteren
http://annevankesteren.nl/
Received on Thursday, 24 September 2009 16:48:21 UTC

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