W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > public-html-a11y@w3.org > August 2012

Re: why are we pursuing this idea? (was: Implementation Details request on Issue 204 Decision)

From: Steve Faulkner <faulkner.steve@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2012 22:40:22 +0100
Message-ID: <CA+ri+Vm=stuE_Q-i78SEP9SbV6o8mvGaFpSn-LGHXyMHdUEeYQ@mail.gmail.com>
To: Leif Halvard Silli <xn--mlform-iua@xn--mlform-iua.no>
Cc: Chaals McCathieNevile <w3b@chaals.com>, John Foliot <john@foliot.ca>, Maciej Stachowiak <mjs@apple.com>, public-html@w3.org, HTML Accessibility Task Force <public-html-a11y@w3.org>
hi leif,

>Given that Steve’s focus on A11Y APIs, then I don't understand that he
>mention this statement by NVDA developer James Teh.

if you read back in the thread you will see it was in response to
chaals asking me for a reference to my previous statement:

"I also think that some AT will simply not implement the rich hidden
content model as described, The NVDA developers have not implemented
longdesc due to it having no visible UI (for example)."

in other words it doesn't help to have stuff exposed by browsers if AT
don't make use of it.

regards
SteveF

On 21 August 2012 20:41, Leif Halvard Silli
<xn--mlform-iua@xn--mlform-iua.no> wrote:
> Chaals McCathieNevile, Tue, 21 Aug 2012 19:27:38 +0200, in reply to
> Steve:
>>> James teh wrote [3]:
>>>
>>> "To clarify my position on this: I have no problem with the idea of
>>> the longdesc attribute. However, I believe it should be discoverable
>>> to *all* users, not just users of assistive technology. This means
>>> that the right place to implement this is in the browser (where all
>>> users can access it), not in screen readers such as NVDA."
>>
>> OK. For what it is worth, I agree 100%. I still think it would be helping
>> NVDA users to implement longdesc support.
>
> Given that Steve’s focus on A11Y APIs, then I don't understand that he
> mention this statement by NVDA developer James Teh. What James Teh says
> sounds in theory very correct. But when one thinks about it, then it
> sounds like he demands an egg before he will agree to keep chicken - or
> opposite. Here is why:
>
> * iCab *does* support longdesc. However, VoiceOver has no support for
>   it, so is doesn't help that it has been implemented in the browser.
>   (VoiceOver works essentially as well with iCab as it works with
>   Safari. This is different from e.g. OmniWeb, which is quite
>   broken with regard to VoiceOver. [OmniWeb also implements @alt in
>   a way that is more like Firefox, so it seems to modify Webkit
>   much more.])
>
> * Also, Firefox has support for @longdesc - I mean: that is Steve’s
> point.
>   So why doesn't NVDA have support for it?
>
> From listening what Steve says about other things, then it seems to me
> that the support has to come in the accessibility API first. And for
> @longdesc in Firefox, then the API is ready. Hence, I don't understand
> James Teh's reasoning.
>
> Not my field at all, unfortunately, but of there had been a documented
> way for iCab to extend VoiceOver so that e.g. would announce a longdesc
> as something activate-able, then I pretty sure that developer would
> have done it.
> --
> leif halvard silli
Received on Tuesday, 21 August 2012 21:41:31 GMT

This archive was generated by hypermail 2.2.0+W3C-0.50 : Tuesday, 21 August 2012 21:41:31 GMT