W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > public-html-a11y@w3.org > August 2012

Re: FORMAL OBJECTION (was RE: Working Group Decision on ISSUE-204 aria-hidden)

From: Maciej Stachowiak <mjs@apple.com>
Date: Tue, 14 Aug 2012 21:13:02 -0700
Cc: Janina Sajka <janina@rednote.net>, Benjamin Hawkes-Lewis <bhawkeslewis@googlemail.com>, John Foliot <john@foliot.ca>, Sam Ruby <rubys@intertwingly.net>, "public-html@w3.org" <public-html@w3.org>, HTML Accessibility Task Force <public-html-a11y@w3.org>
Message-id: <561348C3-CA80-435F-B845-3659AD882D9B@apple.com>
To: Charles Pritchard <chuck@jumis.com>

On Aug 14, 2012, at 8:38 PM, Charles Pritchard <chuck@jumis.com> wrote:

> On Aug 14, 2012, at 4:27 PM, Maciej Stachowiak <mjs@apple.com> wrote:
> 
>> (1) For a sighted user using the keyboard (or other alternative input):
>> - The image shows up, and none of the associated text is read out loud, and the link is not in the tab cycle.
>> 
>> (2) For a user using VoiceOver, with default settings:
>> - When the VO cursor is on the image, the screen reader says "the reddit logo", pauses briefly, and says "image"
> 
> Note that there may be a visual indicator of where the cursor is at this point.

Yes, there's a visual indicator around the image (referred to as the VoiceOver cursor).

> 
>> - When the user hits Ctrl+Opt+Shift+H (the VO shortcut for longer descriptive text), the screen reader says "the reddit logo, showing the reddit alien mascot".
>> - The link is not in the tab cycle.
> 
> Would the link wind up in the link rotor? 

In the current implementation, it does not. If WebKit exposed rich semantics via aria-describedby, then that would be a design decision based on what ends up more usable.

> 
> Within this example, it does seem more appropriate that the link exist on the image itself. There are other tags that may make for a better example, something like abbr, for instance.

My example may be a little imperfect, but I did try to pick a case where both the fallback version and the full semantic version might be useful. That being said, in my example, I think putting the link around the image would not be quite right, because then the text of the link would be "the reddit logo", but it actually links to reddit itself, not to its logo.

> 
> In existing browsers this particular example is not too harmful--  the user may get some bracket quotationmark http noise, but nothing too bad.

I don't believe you will get that noise, due to the historic flattening behavior of aria-describedby.

Thanks for constructively engaging in this discussion.

Regards,
Maciej
Received on Wednesday, 15 August 2012 04:13:03 GMT

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